Odd Lots

#1

Why It's So Hard for Apple to Move Production from China to India

President Trump wants Apple to make iPhones in America. The company itself has talked about — and to some extent already has been — moving more of its production to other countries, like India. But in reality, Apple remains deeply, deeply enmeshed in the Chinese supply chain. In fact, the rise of Apple, and the iPhone specifically, is the ultimate example of the link between the American and Chinese economies. And while this has been fruitful for shareholders all around the world, and contributed greatly to Chinese economic development, this relationship is also now perceived to be a huge source of geopolitical vulnerability for the United States. On this episode, we speak with Patrick McGee, a reporter at the Financial Times and the author of the new book Apple In China: The Capture of the World's Greatest Company. He talks to us about how Apple discovered the opportunity of doing more manufacturing in China, and how close the company has become with Chinese political leadership. We walk through both the politics and the economics that makes it almost impossible to imagine the company building its products anywhere else at significant scale.Odd Lots Live is returning to New York City on June 26. Get your tickets here!See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-06-02•52mins

Why It's So Hard for Apple to Move Production from China to India

President Trump wants Apple to make iPhones in America. The company itself has talked about — and to some extent already has been — moving more of its production to other countries, like India. But in reality, Apple remains deeply, deeply enmeshed in the Chinese supply chain. In fact, the rise of Apple, and the iPhone specifically, is the ultimate example of the link between the American and Chinese economies. And while this has been fruitful for shareholders all around the world, and contributed greatly to Chinese economic development, this relationship is also now perceived to be a huge source of geopolitical vulnerability for the United States. On this episode, we speak with Patrick McGee, a reporter at the Financial Times and the author of the new book Apple In China: The Capture of the World's Greatest Company. He talks to us about how Apple discovered the opportunity of doing more manufacturing in China, and how close the company has become with Chinese political leadership. We walk through both the politics and the economics that makes it almost impossible to imagine the company building its products anywhere else at significant scale.Odd Lots Live is returning to New York City on June 26. Get your tickets here!See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-06-02•52mins

#1

#2

How Do We Define a Currency?

What is a currency? This turns out to be one of those questions we just kind of skip over because we don't have clear answers to it (and because economists often like to skip over these foundational things). This special episode of the Odd Lots podcast was recorded as part of Princeton University's “How to Write the Biography of a Currency” event, hosted by the Princeton Economic History Workshop and the Julis-Rabinowitz Center for Public Policy & Finance. In this discussion, we talk about how we should define a currency and how that definition has changed (or not) over time. Our panelists were Iñaki Aldasoro, an economist at the Bank for International Settlements, Indiana University Bloomington Professor Rebecca Spang, and Stefan Ingves, the former head of the Sveriges Riksbank, the central bank of Sweden, from 2006 to 2022. Read more:Dollar Drops on Renewed Trade Uncertainty, Soft Economic DataAsia’s $7.5 Trillion Bet on US Assets Is Suddenly Unraveling Only Bloomberg - Business News, Stock Markets, Finance, Breaking & World News subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox each week, plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-31•1hr 2mins

How Do We Define a Currency?

What is a currency? This turns out to be one of those questions we just kind of skip over because we don't have clear answers to it (and because economists often like to skip over these foundational things). This special episode of the Odd Lots podcast was recorded as part of Princeton University's “How to Write the Biography of a Currency” event, hosted by the Princeton Economic History Workshop and the Julis-Rabinowitz Center for Public Policy & Finance. In this discussion, we talk about how we should define a currency and how that definition has changed (or not) over time. Our panelists were Iñaki Aldasoro, an economist at the Bank for International Settlements, Indiana University Bloomington Professor Rebecca Spang, and Stefan Ingves, the former head of the Sveriges Riksbank, the central bank of Sweden, from 2006 to 2022. Read more:Dollar Drops on Renewed Trade Uncertainty, Soft Economic DataAsia’s $7.5 Trillion Bet on US Assets Is Suddenly Unraveling Only Bloomberg - Business News, Stock Markets, Finance, Breaking & World News subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox each week, plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-31•1hr 2mins

#2

#3

Krishna Memani on Wall Street's Very Expensive "Free Lunch"

We're told over and over again that the one "free lunch" in investing is diversification, and that you can improve your returns over time simply by investing in a wider range of assets. This is textbook modern finance. And yet over the past several years this hasn't been the case. An investor would have done great (with the occasional hiccups) just by investing in US stocks. What's more, even within US stocks, investors should have concentrated on big tech stocks. Going long US tech has been identified as the most crowded trade by investors for years, and yet most of the time it has outperformed almost everything else. So what are the lessons from this story? And is now the moment where international diversification is going to work? On this episode, we speak with veteran portfolio manager Krishna Memani, who is now the chief investment officer at Lafayette College. Previously, he was the CIO at OppenheimerFunds, which got bought by Invesco. We talk about portfolio theory, the tragedy of the prudent international investor over recent decades, and whether that realized return we've seen across a range of asset classes should prompt a fundamental rethink of finance theory. Odd Lots Live is returning to New York City on June 26. Get your tickets here!See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-30•47mins

Krishna Memani on Wall Street's Very Expensive "Free Lunch"

We're told over and over again that the one "free lunch" in investing is diversification, and that you can improve your returns over time simply by investing in a wider range of assets. This is textbook modern finance. And yet over the past several years this hasn't been the case. An investor would have done great (with the occasional hiccups) just by investing in US stocks. What's more, even within US stocks, investors should have concentrated on big tech stocks. Going long US tech has been identified as the most crowded trade by investors for years, and yet most of the time it has outperformed almost everything else. So what are the lessons from this story? And is now the moment where international diversification is going to work? On this episode, we speak with veteran portfolio manager Krishna Memani, who is now the chief investment officer at Lafayette College. Previously, he was the CIO at OppenheimerFunds, which got bought by Invesco. We talk about portfolio theory, the tragedy of the prudent international investor over recent decades, and whether that realized return we've seen across a range of asset classes should prompt a fundamental rethink of finance theory. Odd Lots Live is returning to New York City on June 26. Get your tickets here!See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-30•47mins

#3

#4

Michael Cembalest on Why AI Is the Stock Market Bet of the Century

Michael Cembalest has been an investment analyst for almost 40 years and his research notes have drawn a cult following on Wall Street. He's known for going super deep into a wide range of topics, like energy and healthcare. And lately he's been writing a lot about AI, with a particular interest in figuring out whether all the investment in data centers and compute will translate into actual profits. On this episode, we talk to the chair of market and investment strategy for JPMorgan Asset Management about why AI is the market "bet of the century," why the dominance of US big tech can't be overstated, and why he's pessimistic about the outlook for small modular nuclear reactors.Odd Lots Live is returning to New York City on June 26. Get your tickets here!See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-29•1hr 4mins

Michael Cembalest on Why AI Is the Stock Market Bet of the Century

Michael Cembalest has been an investment analyst for almost 40 years and his research notes have drawn a cult following on Wall Street. He's known for going super deep into a wide range of topics, like energy and healthcare. And lately he's been writing a lot about AI, with a particular interest in figuring out whether all the investment in data centers and compute will translate into actual profits. On this episode, we talk to the chair of market and investment strategy for JPMorgan Asset Management about why AI is the market "bet of the century," why the dominance of US big tech can't be overstated, and why he's pessimistic about the outlook for small modular nuclear reactors.Odd Lots Live is returning to New York City on June 26. Get your tickets here!See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-29•1hr 4mins

#4

#5

Why Asset Allocators Love Multi-Strategy Hedge Funds

Multi-strategy hedge funds have been having a moment with big asset allocators pouring billions of dollars into names like Millennium and Citadel. And given all the growth, multi-strat funds have also been battling each other for talent. But why, exactly, do big investors seem to love multi-strats so much? What actually makes a multi-strat good to invest in? And how do fees and compensation work? In this episode, we speak with Ronan Cosgrave, a partner at Albourne Partners, which advises institutional investors on investing in hedge funds and other alternative asset classes. We talk about key differences between multi-strats and pod shops, plus the importance of pay to the business model.The Math Powering Profits at Multi-Strategy Hedge FundsMultistrategy Hedge Funds Delivered Again in 2024 Odd Lots Live is returning to New York City on June 26. Get your tickets here!See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-26•54mins

Why Asset Allocators Love Multi-Strategy Hedge Funds

Multi-strategy hedge funds have been having a moment with big asset allocators pouring billions of dollars into names like Millennium and Citadel. And given all the growth, multi-strat funds have also been battling each other for talent. But why, exactly, do big investors seem to love multi-strats so much? What actually makes a multi-strat good to invest in? And how do fees and compensation work? In this episode, we speak with Ronan Cosgrave, a partner at Albourne Partners, which advises institutional investors on investing in hedge funds and other alternative asset classes. We talk about key differences between multi-strats and pod shops, plus the importance of pay to the business model.The Math Powering Profits at Multi-Strategy Hedge FundsMultistrategy Hedge Funds Delivered Again in 2024 Odd Lots Live is returning to New York City on June 26. Get your tickets here!See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-26•54mins

#5

#6

Zohran Mamdani, the Socialist Who Could Be NYC's New Mayor

We're just a month away from the hotly-contested Democratic primary for New York City Mayor. And one of the candidates -- Queens assemblyman Zohran Mamdani -- is running on a somewhat unusual platform. Endorsed by the Democratic Socialists of America, he's proposing rent freezes, universal childcare, higher taxes on corporations and the wealthy, free buses, and city-run grocery stores. In this conversation, we talk to the would-be mayor about his socialist vision for New York, including how he plans to fund more public goods, what he would do to ensure that government-run services are up to standard, and why there should be Halal carts on every street corner. Read more: NYC Mayor Ditches Democratic Primary to Seek Independent BidOdd Lots Live is returning to New York City on June 26. Get your tickets here!See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-23•52mins

Zohran Mamdani, the Socialist Who Could Be NYC's New Mayor

We're just a month away from the hotly-contested Democratic primary for New York City Mayor. And one of the candidates -- Queens assemblyman Zohran Mamdani -- is running on a somewhat unusual platform. Endorsed by the Democratic Socialists of America, he's proposing rent freezes, universal childcare, higher taxes on corporations and the wealthy, free buses, and city-run grocery stores. In this conversation, we talk to the would-be mayor about his socialist vision for New York, including how he plans to fund more public goods, what he would do to ensure that government-run services are up to standard, and why there should be Halal carts on every street corner. Read more: NYC Mayor Ditches Democratic Primary to Seek Independent BidOdd Lots Live is returning to New York City on June 26. Get your tickets here!See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-23•52mins

#6

#7

Why Interest Rates Are Shooting Up All Around the World

This week the big story in markets is the selloff in bonds. Yields on benchmark 10-year US Treasuries jumped 20 basis points from last Friday’s low, while the 30-year rate is back above 5%. Meanwhile, 30-year Japanese government bonds clocked their highest yield since records began in 1999. And rates on UK gilts, German bunds, and Australian bonds are also rising. To make matters even more unusual, US Treasury yields are going up while the dollar is weakening (something that doesn’t usually happen.) So what’s going on? And how much does this have to with worries over the US fiscal position, the return of inflation, and the outlook for rate cuts from the Federal Reserve? On this episode, we speak with Steven Englander, global head of G-10 FX research at Standard Chartered. We talk about what’s driving the dramatic moves and the relationship between fiscal and monetary policy.Read more:Deglobalization’s Threat to the Bond MarketUS Bonds Swing as Dip Buyers Enter After Moody’s-Fueled SelloffOdd Lots Live is returning to New York City on June 26. Get your tickets here!See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-22•48mins

Why Interest Rates Are Shooting Up All Around the World

This week the big story in markets is the selloff in bonds. Yields on benchmark 10-year US Treasuries jumped 20 basis points from last Friday’s low, while the 30-year rate is back above 5%. Meanwhile, 30-year Japanese government bonds clocked their highest yield since records began in 1999. And rates on UK gilts, German bunds, and Australian bonds are also rising. To make matters even more unusual, US Treasury yields are going up while the dollar is weakening (something that doesn’t usually happen.) So what’s going on? And how much does this have to with worries over the US fiscal position, the return of inflation, and the outlook for rate cuts from the Federal Reserve? On this episode, we speak with Steven Englander, global head of G-10 FX research at Standard Chartered. We talk about what’s driving the dramatic moves and the relationship between fiscal and monetary policy.Read more:Deglobalization’s Threat to the Bond MarketUS Bonds Swing as Dip Buyers Enter After Moody’s-Fueled SelloffOdd Lots Live is returning to New York City on June 26. Get your tickets here!See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-22•48mins

#7

#8

Scott Bok on How Bankers Spread the Gospel of Capitalism

When we think about the prospect of deglobalization (whatever that means) we often think about it in terms of the goods economy. Supply chains get rerouted. Manufacturing becomes more localized, and possibly less efficient. But changes to the global world order also have implications for Wall Street, and the world of dealmaking. On this episode of the podcast, we speak with Scott Bok, the longtime former chairman and CEO of the investment bank Greenhill & Co., which is now part of Mizuho. Scott is the author of the new book, Surviving Wall Street: A Tale of Triumph, Tragedy, and Timing, which covers his long career as an investment banker starting in the early 1980s. We talk about what investment bankers actually do, and also how the great Wall Street dealmaking boom over the last several decades is, in large part, a story of globalization, and the opportunity for firms to roll up localized companies into cross-border giants. He talks to us about how the bankers themselves served as essentially evangelists of the pro-capitalism message of the Reagan era, spreading the gospel of shareholder primacy all around the world. Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-19•58mins

Scott Bok on How Bankers Spread the Gospel of Capitalism

When we think about the prospect of deglobalization (whatever that means) we often think about it in terms of the goods economy. Supply chains get rerouted. Manufacturing becomes more localized, and possibly less efficient. But changes to the global world order also have implications for Wall Street, and the world of dealmaking. On this episode of the podcast, we speak with Scott Bok, the longtime former chairman and CEO of the investment bank Greenhill & Co., which is now part of Mizuho. Scott is the author of the new book, Surviving Wall Street: A Tale of Triumph, Tragedy, and Timing, which covers his long career as an investment banker starting in the early 1980s. We talk about what investment bankers actually do, and also how the great Wall Street dealmaking boom over the last several decades is, in large part, a story of globalization, and the opportunity for firms to roll up localized companies into cross-border giants. He talks to us about how the bankers themselves served as essentially evangelists of the pro-capitalism message of the Reagan era, spreading the gospel of shareholder primacy all around the world. Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-19•58mins

#8

Listen to your favourite podcasts.

Now ad-free.

Download herd and enjoy uninterrupted, high-quality podcasts without the wait.

Download on the

App Store

Herd app interface showing podcast library

#9

Atlanta Fed's Raphael Bostic on Monetary Policy During Extreme Uncertainty

This is obviously an extraordinarily difficult time to make economic forecasts. Nobody really knows how tariffs will affect the US economy. And beyond that, nobody knows what the ultimate state of tariffs will be, or if they'll ever settle into a predictable rate. So how do you conduct monetary policy in this environment? On this episode, recorded at the Federal Reserve Bank in Atlanta, we spoke with Atlanta Fed President Raphael Bostic. He walked us through how he's thinking about the dual mandate right now, and why he has significantly dialed back his expectations for aggressive rate cuts since the start of 2025. Read More:For Exhausted Stock Market Pros the Choice Is Buy or Stay HomePowell Signals 2020 Fed Framework Language on Chopping Block Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-16•53mins

Atlanta Fed's Raphael Bostic on Monetary Policy During Extreme Uncertainty

This is obviously an extraordinarily difficult time to make economic forecasts. Nobody really knows how tariffs will affect the US economy. And beyond that, nobody knows what the ultimate state of tariffs will be, or if they'll ever settle into a predictable rate. So how do you conduct monetary policy in this environment? On this episode, recorded at the Federal Reserve Bank in Atlanta, we spoke with Atlanta Fed President Raphael Bostic. He walked us through how he's thinking about the dual mandate right now, and why he has significantly dialed back his expectations for aggressive rate cuts since the start of 2025. Read More:For Exhausted Stock Market Pros the Choice Is Buy or Stay HomePowell Signals 2020 Fed Framework Language on Chopping Block Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-16•53mins

#9

#10

The Oil Industry's Double Whammy of Higher Costs and Lower Prices

The new administration has a "drill, baby, drill" mantra and a much more liberal attitude towards the oil and gas industry than the last one. But that hasn't translated into great profits for the oil industry itself. Crude prices have sunk and tariffs have raised the cost of components for companies trying to get energy out of the ground. So, what's the future for the industry? And who is actually making money right now? In this episode, we talk to longtime energy industry veteran Peter Tertzakian, the founder and president of Studio.energy, which consults with various industry players. We discuss the state of the overall North American energy industry, the prospects of peak onshore oil production in the United States, pipeline politics, and why liquified natural gas is expected to be the hydrocarbon of the future. Read more:Say Hello to ‘Nil, Baby, Nil’ in the Oil PatchTrump’s Thirst for Cheap Oil Irks an Industry He Loves to Praise Only subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox each week, plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-15•48mins

The Oil Industry's Double Whammy of Higher Costs and Lower Prices

The new administration has a "drill, baby, drill" mantra and a much more liberal attitude towards the oil and gas industry than the last one. But that hasn't translated into great profits for the oil industry itself. Crude prices have sunk and tariffs have raised the cost of components for companies trying to get energy out of the ground. So, what's the future for the industry? And who is actually making money right now? In this episode, we talk to longtime energy industry veteran Peter Tertzakian, the founder and president of Studio.energy, which consults with various industry players. We discuss the state of the overall North American energy industry, the prospects of peak onshore oil production in the United States, pipeline politics, and why liquified natural gas is expected to be the hydrocarbon of the future. Read more:Say Hello to ‘Nil, Baby, Nil’ in the Oil PatchTrump’s Thirst for Cheap Oil Irks an Industry He Loves to Praise Only subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox each week, plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-15•48mins

#10

#11

Perry Mehrling on Trump's Echoes of the Nixon Shock

There's been a lot of talk recently about parallels between Donald Trump's economic policies and the Nixon Shock of the early 1970s. That was when the former president took the dollar off the gold standard, introduced hefty tariffs, and pressured the Federal Reserve to ease monetary policy. The moves sparked stagflation in the US and shook up the global monetary order. Now, given Trump's determination to rebalance the US relationship with global trading partners and his criticism of the Fed, could history repeat itself? On this episode, we speak with Perry Mehrling, professor of international political economy at Boston University's Pardee School of Global Studies, and the author of the book Money and Empire. We talk to him about similarities and differences between the Trump administration's current economic policies and the Nixon Shock, as well as why he thinks dollar dominance won't be dislodged anytime soon.Read more:Dollar Poised for Worst First 100 Days of Presidency Since NixonThe Problem With the Fed Isn’t Independence, It’s Accountability Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-14•32mins

Perry Mehrling on Trump's Echoes of the Nixon Shock

There's been a lot of talk recently about parallels between Donald Trump's economic policies and the Nixon Shock of the early 1970s. That was when the former president took the dollar off the gold standard, introduced hefty tariffs, and pressured the Federal Reserve to ease monetary policy. The moves sparked stagflation in the US and shook up the global monetary order. Now, given Trump's determination to rebalance the US relationship with global trading partners and his criticism of the Fed, could history repeat itself? On this episode, we speak with Perry Mehrling, professor of international political economy at Boston University's Pardee School of Global Studies, and the author of the book Money and Empire. We talk to him about similarities and differences between the Trump administration's current economic policies and the Nixon Shock, as well as why he thinks dollar dominance won't be dislodged anytime soon.Read more:Dollar Poised for Worst First 100 Days of Presidency Since NixonThe Problem With the Fed Isn’t Independence, It’s Accountability Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-14•32mins

#11

#12

Philip Diehl on the Booming Business of Gold Coins

Gold prices have been booming and are near record highs. And seeing the line go up — especially during a period of so much uncertainty — makes people want to buy more. That includes acquiring actual gold coins. But where do gold coins come from? Why do people want coins, as opposed to just bullion? And who is buying them? On this episode, we speak with Philip Diehl, the president of gold vendor US Money Reserve. Earlier in his career, he was the 35th director of the US Mint, where he was instrumental in such endeavors as the 50 States quarter project, the Sacagawea dollar coin, and also the language that allows for the creation of the trillion-dollar platinum coin. We talk all about the business and supply chain of coinage, and who's buying these coins today. Watch on YouTubeRead more: Gold Advances as Market Weighs Upcoming US-China Trade Talks Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox -- now delivered every weekday -- plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-12•47mins

Philip Diehl on the Booming Business of Gold Coins

Gold prices have been booming and are near record highs. And seeing the line go up — especially during a period of so much uncertainty — makes people want to buy more. That includes acquiring actual gold coins. But where do gold coins come from? Why do people want coins, as opposed to just bullion? And who is buying them? On this episode, we speak with Philip Diehl, the president of gold vendor US Money Reserve. Earlier in his career, he was the 35th director of the US Mint, where he was instrumental in such endeavors as the 50 States quarter project, the Sacagawea dollar coin, and also the language that allows for the creation of the trillion-dollar platinum coin. We talk all about the business and supply chain of coinage, and who's buying these coins today. Watch on YouTubeRead more: Gold Advances as Market Weighs Upcoming US-China Trade Talks Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox -- now delivered every weekday -- plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-12•47mins

#12

#13

Why the World Keeps Getting Shocked by China's Technological Progress

Over the last several years, the world has watched as China edges close to or past the technological frontier in more and more areas. Earlier this year, US investors were jolted even further when DeepSeek's AI model proved to be close to the state of the art American models. So what is the process by which China actually develops new tech? Why has it worked out so well? And how do priorities set by President Xi Jinping actually get transmitted to researchers and businesses? On this episode, we speak to Kaiser Kuo, the host of the Sinica podcast. He discusses the cultural dimension of tariffs, and what he sees as a fundamentally different attitude towards the benefits of technological progress in China vs. what is seen in the US.Read more:I’m a DeepSeek AI Bro Now Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-10•44mins

Why the World Keeps Getting Shocked by China's Technological Progress

Over the last several years, the world has watched as China edges close to or past the technological frontier in more and more areas. Earlier this year, US investors were jolted even further when DeepSeek's AI model proved to be close to the state of the art American models. So what is the process by which China actually develops new tech? Why has it worked out so well? And how do priorities set by President Xi Jinping actually get transmitted to researchers and businesses? On this episode, we speak to Kaiser Kuo, the host of the Sinica podcast. He discusses the cultural dimension of tariffs, and what he sees as a fundamentally different attitude towards the benefits of technological progress in China vs. what is seen in the US.Read more:I’m a DeepSeek AI Bro Now Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-10•44mins

#13

#14

Sarah LaFleur On the Existential Threat From the Tariffs

America's textile industry has famously declined over the years, with a bunch of production moving to lower-cost places like China, Vietnam, and Bangladesh. Now, with the Trump administration imposing heavy tariffs on exports from these countries, the US clothing industry is facing another big shock. In this episode we speak with Sarah LaFleur, founder and CEO of M.M.LaFleur, which makes high-quality work clothing for women (Tracy is a big fan). She walks us through what the past month has actually been like for a smaller clothing business trying to understand and deal with the tariffs. We talk about the conversations she's been having with mills and factories in China, how the tariffs are already impacting future seasons of clothing, the scramble to secure space on ships before the tariffs hit, and how businesses actually pay the new taxes.Read more: A New ‘China Shock’ Is Destroying Jobs Around the WorldOne Ship, $417 Million in New Tariffs: The Cost of Trump’s Trade WarOnly Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-09•45mins

Sarah LaFleur On the Existential Threat From the Tariffs

America's textile industry has famously declined over the years, with a bunch of production moving to lower-cost places like China, Vietnam, and Bangladesh. Now, with the Trump administration imposing heavy tariffs on exports from these countries, the US clothing industry is facing another big shock. In this episode we speak with Sarah LaFleur, founder and CEO of M.M.LaFleur, which makes high-quality work clothing for women (Tracy is a big fan). She walks us through what the past month has actually been like for a smaller clothing business trying to understand and deal with the tariffs. We talk about the conversations she's been having with mills and factories in China, how the tariffs are already impacting future seasons of clothing, the scramble to secure space on ships before the tariffs hit, and how businesses actually pay the new taxes.Read more: A New ‘China Shock’ Is Destroying Jobs Around the WorldOne Ship, $417 Million in New Tariffs: The Cost of Trump’s Trade WarOnly Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-09•45mins

#14

#15

How China Might Actually Handle a US Trade War

By now, everyone recognizes that the US and China are in the middle of a trade war, with the Trump administration having imposed tariffs of as much as 125% on Chinese goods. For an export-focused economy like China's, that's a big deal. At the same time, China is pretty much the only major country that's chosen to retaliate against the US with its own set of fresh trade restrictions. So why did it decide to reciprocate? And what's its negotiating position as the US and China head into initial talks? Can the Chinese economy -- and its policymakers -- withstand the pain of a trade war? We speak to Arthur Kroeber, head of research at Gavekal Dragonomics and a long-time China watcher, about how China might actually respond to the new tariff regime. Read more:Xi Fortifies China’s Economy Before First Talks on Trade With USWhat Years of Practice Tariffs Have Done Only subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox each week, plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-08•57mins

How China Might Actually Handle a US Trade War

By now, everyone recognizes that the US and China are in the middle of a trade war, with the Trump administration having imposed tariffs of as much as 125% on Chinese goods. For an export-focused economy like China's, that's a big deal. At the same time, China is pretty much the only major country that's chosen to retaliate against the US with its own set of fresh trade restrictions. So why did it decide to reciprocate? And what's its negotiating position as the US and China head into initial talks? Can the Chinese economy -- and its policymakers -- withstand the pain of a trade war? We speak to Arthur Kroeber, head of research at Gavekal Dragonomics and a long-time China watcher, about how China might actually respond to the new tariff regime. Read more:Xi Fortifies China’s Economy Before First Talks on Trade With USWhat Years of Practice Tariffs Have Done Only subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox each week, plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-08•57mins

#15

#16

The Tariff Buzzsaw Is Coming For Hardcore Gamers

Every industry is going to be affected by the trade war in different ways. In many cases, we don't know how it's going to play out. Other industries are seeing an immediate impact. Companies that specialize in computer gaming are highly reliant on inputs from China and other East Asian countries. These companies assemble customized gaming rigs and other peripherals (cameras, chairs, controllers, speakers etc.). On this episode, we're joined by Stephen Burke, the founder of Gamers Nexus, a publication and YouTube channel that primarily exists to review products in this space. When the tariffs were announced in early April, he immediately set out to film a documentary titled The Death of Affordable Computing. In that 3-hour video, he talked to numerous players in the space on their profit margins, and how they will be hurt by the changing trade policy. We speak to Steve about this industry, and what he learned about what tariffs will do to both their profitability, or even their viability as ongoing businesses. Read more:Microsoft Raises Xbox and Game Prices, Citing Rising CostsAmazon, Apple Earnings Show Tariffs Are Coming for Big Tech, Too Only subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox each week, plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-07•53mins

The Tariff Buzzsaw Is Coming For Hardcore Gamers

Every industry is going to be affected by the trade war in different ways. In many cases, we don't know how it's going to play out. Other industries are seeing an immediate impact. Companies that specialize in computer gaming are highly reliant on inputs from China and other East Asian countries. These companies assemble customized gaming rigs and other peripherals (cameras, chairs, controllers, speakers etc.). On this episode, we're joined by Stephen Burke, the founder of Gamers Nexus, a publication and YouTube channel that primarily exists to review products in this space. When the tariffs were announced in early April, he immediately set out to film a documentary titled The Death of Affordable Computing. In that 3-hour video, he talked to numerous players in the space on their profit margins, and how they will be hurt by the changing trade policy. We speak to Steve about this industry, and what he learned about what tariffs will do to both their profitability, or even their viability as ongoing businesses. Read more:Microsoft Raises Xbox and Game Prices, Citing Rising CostsAmazon, Apple Earnings Show Tariffs Are Coming for Big Tech, Too Only subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox each week, plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-07•53mins

#16

#17

Brad Setser on the Big Surge in the Taiwanese Dollar

There are several markets that have really settled down since the tumult of early April. But strange, unusual things are still popping up, particularly in the currency space. Over the last few days, we've seen a huge surge in the Taiwan dollar. This is important, in part, because Taiwanese life insurance companies are major buyers of US dollar assets, such as corporate bonds. Suddenly, they're looking at a major hit to the value of these holdings, with losses that are only partially hedged. So why the sudden move, and what does it mean? On this episode, we speak with Brad Setser, a senior fellow at the Council on Foreign Relations. We first talked to Brad about exactly this topic back in 2019, when the story was more of an intellectual curiosity rather than a market-moving development. We discuss the implications, and what it means in the context of the Trump administration's trade strategy. More:Why Taiwanese Life Insurers Are The Great ‘Whodunit' Of The Financial WorldTaiwan’s Markets Jolted as Currency Surges Most Since 1980s Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-06•32mins

Brad Setser on the Big Surge in the Taiwanese Dollar

There are several markets that have really settled down since the tumult of early April. But strange, unusual things are still popping up, particularly in the currency space. Over the last few days, we've seen a huge surge in the Taiwan dollar. This is important, in part, because Taiwanese life insurance companies are major buyers of US dollar assets, such as corporate bonds. Suddenly, they're looking at a major hit to the value of these holdings, with losses that are only partially hedged. So why the sudden move, and what does it mean? On this episode, we speak with Brad Setser, a senior fellow at the Council on Foreign Relations. We first talked to Brad about exactly this topic back in 2019, when the story was more of an intellectual curiosity rather than a market-moving development. We discuss the implications, and what it means in the context of the Trump administration's trade strategy. More:Why Taiwanese Life Insurers Are The Great ‘Whodunit' Of The Financial WorldTaiwan’s Markets Jolted as Currency Surges Most Since 1980s Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-06•32mins

#17

#18

Henry Blodget on AI, Dot-Coms, and What's Changed In 25 Years

What does history say about how big the AI boom can get, and who will ultimately win out? When does a boom turn into a bubble that turns into a bust? On this episode of the podcast, we speak to Henry Blodget, the founder of Business Insider (and Joe's old boss there). In the late '90s, Henry was one of the most well-known Wall Street analysts covering internet stocks, before the crash and recriminations, which ended up in his lifetime ban from the industry. His new project is a publication called Regenerator, which will again focus on business and tech. We discuss the state of the AI boom, and what lessons we can draw from the dot-com era. We also talk politics, what's changed on Wall Street over the last 25 years or so, and a bit on the state of the media business. Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-05•59mins

Henry Blodget on AI, Dot-Coms, and What's Changed In 25 Years

What does history say about how big the AI boom can get, and who will ultimately win out? When does a boom turn into a bubble that turns into a bust? On this episode of the podcast, we speak to Henry Blodget, the founder of Business Insider (and Joe's old boss there). In the late '90s, Henry was one of the most well-known Wall Street analysts covering internet stocks, before the crash and recriminations, which ended up in his lifetime ban from the industry. His new project is a publication called Regenerator, which will again focus on business and tech. We discuss the state of the AI boom, and what lessons we can draw from the dot-com era. We also talk politics, what's changed on Wall Street over the last 25 years or so, and a bit on the state of the media business. Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-05•59mins

#18

#19

Chris Hughes on How to Craft a Thriving Market

Over the last several years, both parties in the US have been drifting away from laissez-faire thinking about the economy, and more towards the view that the state has an active role in shaping markets. You have Republicans talking about stricter anti-trust and sovereign wealth funds, and of course Democrats embracing things like industrial policy efforts in key strategic sectors. But how do you design markets well? When does it fail? And what is the history of this type of thing in the US. In this episode, we speak with Facebook co-founder-turned-economist Chris Hughes, who has published the new book Marketcrafters: The 100-Year Struggle to Shape the American Economy. In this conversation, recorded at the New York Public Library in April, we talk about his research on the history of marketcraft in the US, and how that study of history informs his understanding of today's economic policymaking.Read more: Markets Plummet as Tariff-War Woes Fuel Exodus From US AssetsOnly Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-03•58mins

Chris Hughes on How to Craft a Thriving Market

Over the last several years, both parties in the US have been drifting away from laissez-faire thinking about the economy, and more towards the view that the state has an active role in shaping markets. You have Republicans talking about stricter anti-trust and sovereign wealth funds, and of course Democrats embracing things like industrial policy efforts in key strategic sectors. But how do you design markets well? When does it fail? And what is the history of this type of thing in the US. In this episode, we speak with Facebook co-founder-turned-economist Chris Hughes, who has published the new book Marketcrafters: The 100-Year Struggle to Shape the American Economy. In this conversation, recorded at the New York Public Library in April, we talk about his research on the history of marketcraft in the US, and how that study of history informs his understanding of today's economic policymaking.Read more: Markets Plummet as Tariff-War Woes Fuel Exodus From US AssetsOnly Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-03•58mins

#19

#20

What The 'Lentil King of Saskatchewan' Knows About World Trade

We don't know what the end state for the tariffs are going to be, but inevitably there will be some shifts in the way that goods and dollars flow around the world economy. Of course, some parts of the economy are always subject to changing rules around subsidies and tariffs, and that's particularly true in agriculture. On this episode of the podcast we speak with Murad Al-Katib, the President and CEO of AGT Foods and Ingredients, who is sometimes known as The Lentil King of Saskatchewan. He is credited as being a driving force in turning the Canadian Province into a powerhouse of chickpea and lentil exports all around the world. He explains to us why he saw an opportunity in this space, why it's boomed, how the global trade and supply chain of these plants work, and how his company navigates perpetual shifts in agriculture policy around the world.Read more: Trump’s Canada Tariffs Draw Lawsuit by Blackfeet Nation MembersOnly Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-02•57mins

What The 'Lentil King of Saskatchewan' Knows About World Trade

We don't know what the end state for the tariffs are going to be, but inevitably there will be some shifts in the way that goods and dollars flow around the world economy. Of course, some parts of the economy are always subject to changing rules around subsidies and tariffs, and that's particularly true in agriculture. On this episode of the podcast we speak with Murad Al-Katib, the President and CEO of AGT Foods and Ingredients, who is sometimes known as The Lentil King of Saskatchewan. He is credited as being a driving force in turning the Canadian Province into a powerhouse of chickpea and lentil exports all around the world. He explains to us why he saw an opportunity in this space, why it's boomed, how the global trade and supply chain of these plants work, and how his company navigates perpetual shifts in agriculture policy around the world.Read more: Trump’s Canada Tariffs Draw Lawsuit by Blackfeet Nation MembersOnly Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-02•57mins

#20

#21

Blackstone's King of Hedge Funds on Alt Investing Right Now

Everyone knows by now that college endowment funds have gone big on alternative investing, pouring billions of dollars into private equity and hedge funds. But that investing model now seems to be under pressure and there are reports that Ivy League institutions like Yale and Harvard are looking to unload some of their more illiquid investments. So why did colleges get into alts in the first place? And how do they select which funds to invest in? In this episode, we speak with Joe Dowling, the former head of Brown University's endowment. Joe is now global head of multi-asset investing at Blackstone, one of the biggest institutional investors around. He talks about the rise of alts, how college funds got so invested, the pressures they're facing right now, and the boom in multi-strats.Read more: Harvard in Talks to Sell $1 Billion of Private Equity StakesBlackstone’s King of Hedge Funds Shakes Up Its Lagging BusinessOnly Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-01•52mins

Blackstone's King of Hedge Funds on Alt Investing Right Now

Everyone knows by now that college endowment funds have gone big on alternative investing, pouring billions of dollars into private equity and hedge funds. But that investing model now seems to be under pressure and there are reports that Ivy League institutions like Yale and Harvard are looking to unload some of their more illiquid investments. So why did colleges get into alts in the first place? And how do they select which funds to invest in? In this episode, we speak with Joe Dowling, the former head of Brown University's endowment. Joe is now global head of multi-asset investing at Blackstone, one of the biggest institutional investors around. He talks about the rise of alts, how college funds got so invested, the pressures they're facing right now, and the boom in multi-strats.Read more: Harvard in Talks to Sell $1 Billion of Private Equity StakesBlackstone’s King of Hedge Funds Shakes Up Its Lagging BusinessOnly Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-05-01•52mins

#21

#22

Some of America's Most Important Economic Data Is Decaying

Gathering official economic data is a huge process in the best of times. But a bunch of different things have now combined to make that process even harder. People aren't responding to surveys like they used to. Survey responses have also become a lot more divided along political lines. And at the same time, the Trump administration wants to cut back on government spending, and the worry is that fewer official resources will make tracking the US economy even harder for statistical departments that were already stretched. Bill Beach was commissioner of labor statistics and head of the US Bureau of Labor Statistics during Trump's first presidency and also during President Biden's. On this episode, we talk to him about the importance of official data and why the rails for economic data are deteriorating so quickly. Read more:Houston, We Have a Data ProblemThe US Economy Is Fracturing Too Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-30•51mins

Some of America's Most Important Economic Data Is Decaying

Gathering official economic data is a huge process in the best of times. But a bunch of different things have now combined to make that process even harder. People aren't responding to surveys like they used to. Survey responses have also become a lot more divided along political lines. And at the same time, the Trump administration wants to cut back on government spending, and the worry is that fewer official resources will make tracking the US economy even harder for statistical departments that were already stretched. Bill Beach was commissioner of labor statistics and head of the US Bureau of Labor Statistics during Trump's first presidency and also during President Biden's. On this episode, we talk to him about the importance of official data and why the rails for economic data are deteriorating so quickly. Read more:Houston, We Have a Data ProblemThe US Economy Is Fracturing Too Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-30•51mins

#22

#23

What We Learned About Treasuries on the Night of April 8

When stocks are plunging in a typical market environment, people reach for safe haven assets like US Treasuries. But we've seen that phenomenon break down more and more. It broke down in a sustained way during the intense inflation of 2022. And it's been breaking down again, in an acute way, since President Trump's so-called "Liberation Day." On the night of April 8 and early morning of April 9, we saw a major spike in yields. As Trump put it, the bond market was getting the "yips." But what was actually going on? Who was selling? And why? And what have we learned more broadly about technical and economic demand for US government debt? On this episode, we talked to Ira Jersey, the chief US interest rate strategist at Bloomberg Intelligence, for a crash course in what drives the bond market in both the short and long terms. Read more:The Bond Investors Who Got Trump to Pause His TariffsUS Bonds Rally as Fed’s Hammack Revives Odds of a June Rate Cut Only Bloomberg - Business News, Stock Markets, Finance, Breaking & World News subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox each week, plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-28•47mins

What We Learned About Treasuries on the Night of April 8

When stocks are plunging in a typical market environment, people reach for safe haven assets like US Treasuries. But we've seen that phenomenon break down more and more. It broke down in a sustained way during the intense inflation of 2022. And it's been breaking down again, in an acute way, since President Trump's so-called "Liberation Day." On the night of April 8 and early morning of April 9, we saw a major spike in yields. As Trump put it, the bond market was getting the "yips." But what was actually going on? Who was selling? And why? And what have we learned more broadly about technical and economic demand for US government debt? On this episode, we talked to Ira Jersey, the chief US interest rate strategist at Bloomberg Intelligence, for a crash course in what drives the bond market in both the short and long terms. Read more:The Bond Investors Who Got Trump to Pause His TariffsUS Bonds Rally as Fed’s Hammack Revives Odds of a June Rate Cut Only Bloomberg - Business News, Stock Markets, Finance, Breaking & World News subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox each week, plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-28•47mins

#23

Listen to your favourite podcasts.

Now ad-free.

Download herd and enjoy uninterrupted, high-quality podcasts without the wait.

Download on the

App Store

#24

Lots More on How TikTok Options Traders Got Quiet

Over the last few years, retail traders have gotten into options in a major way. Selling puts, buying calls, trading volatility — what used to be the domain of niche experts engaged in practical hedging has exploded into the public sphere. And there was a lot of easy money during a time when every dip was bought, and stocks mostly just went up. But what have we seen in recent weeks, with the extraordinary trading since April 2? On this episode we bring back one of our favorite guests, Benn Eifert of QVR Advisors. He describes what's been going on in the markets, and why a lot of social media "volfluencers" have suddenly gotten very quiet.Mentioned on this episode:Matt Levine on MicroStrategy’s Infinite Money Machine Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-26•24mins

Lots More on How TikTok Options Traders Got Quiet

Over the last few years, retail traders have gotten into options in a major way. Selling puts, buying calls, trading volatility — what used to be the domain of niche experts engaged in practical hedging has exploded into the public sphere. And there was a lot of easy money during a time when every dip was bought, and stocks mostly just went up. But what have we seen in recent weeks, with the extraordinary trading since April 2? On this episode we bring back one of our favorite guests, Benn Eifert of QVR Advisors. He describes what's been going on in the markets, and why a lot of social media "volfluencers" have suddenly gotten very quiet.Mentioned on this episode:Matt Levine on MicroStrategy’s Infinite Money Machine Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-26•24mins

#24

#25

Anna Wong: Empty Shelves Are Coming Soon

If you look at most of the official hard data right now, there still isn't much evidence of a sharp downturn. Sure, all the surveys are abysmal, but the actual measures of economic activity are ok. But there is already data showing something severe is happening, and that can be seen in the volume of cargo flowing from China to the US. Of course, this is intentional. This is the whole point of tariffs. But the fear is that this is going to be acute and dramatic to consumer companies, and that it will happen very soon. On this episode of the podcast we speak with Anna Wong, Chief US Economist at Bloomberg Economics, who walks us through the real life and macro-economic impact of what we've already seen. She says that the tariffs hit right at the moment that major retailers are planning for their holiday merchandise, and that before too long we'll start seeing fewer goods and fewer varieties of all kinds of things. We also discuss the inflation dynamics, and how tariffs may not show up in terms of higher CPI, but instead through higher layoffs, compressed profit margins, and falling real wages.Read More: The Jaws That Could Devour Your Profit MarginsOnly Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-25•26mins

Anna Wong: Empty Shelves Are Coming Soon

If you look at most of the official hard data right now, there still isn't much evidence of a sharp downturn. Sure, all the surveys are abysmal, but the actual measures of economic activity are ok. But there is already data showing something severe is happening, and that can be seen in the volume of cargo flowing from China to the US. Of course, this is intentional. This is the whole point of tariffs. But the fear is that this is going to be acute and dramatic to consumer companies, and that it will happen very soon. On this episode of the podcast we speak with Anna Wong, Chief US Economist at Bloomberg Economics, who walks us through the real life and macro-economic impact of what we've already seen. She says that the tariffs hit right at the moment that major retailers are planning for their holiday merchandise, and that before too long we'll start seeing fewer goods and fewer varieties of all kinds of things. We also discuss the inflation dynamics, and how tariffs may not show up in terms of higher CPI, but instead through higher layoffs, compressed profit margins, and falling real wages.Read More: The Jaws That Could Devour Your Profit MarginsOnly Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-25•26mins

#25

#26

David Woo: What Trump Started is Worse Than a Trade War

For the most part, Americans haven't felt much pain yet from the tariffs that Donald Trump introduced (and then partially walked back) on April 2. The damage is highly visible in financial markets, but for the moment, shelves remain stocked, inflation measures have remained muted, and there hasn't been a significant wave of layoffs in official data. But according to our guest, real pain is coming. And what's going down is worse than a trade war. On this episode, we speak with the one and only David Woo, now the founder of David Woo Unbound. He also previously served as the Head of Global Rates, Foreign Exchange, and EM Fixed Income and Economics Research at Bank of America. He says that the administration has absolutely nothing to show for its initial months in office on any front. And he says this isn't a game of chicken, where one side can blink and avoid disaster. Instead, we're seeing a "war of attrition" where damage is being done to both the US and Chinese economies as we speak. As he sees it, the China hawks in the administration have been in control, and have the impulse to obliterate the Chinese economy, which makes the situation more than just a so-called trade war. He discusses the political, market, and real economy implications of this dramatic escalation. Read more:Trump U-Turns on Powell, China Follow Dire Economic WarningsA Bad Peace in Ukraine Carries Global Risks Only Bloomberg - Business News, Stock Markets, Finance, Breaking & World News subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox each week, plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-24•49mins

David Woo: What Trump Started is Worse Than a Trade War

For the most part, Americans haven't felt much pain yet from the tariffs that Donald Trump introduced (and then partially walked back) on April 2. The damage is highly visible in financial markets, but for the moment, shelves remain stocked, inflation measures have remained muted, and there hasn't been a significant wave of layoffs in official data. But according to our guest, real pain is coming. And what's going down is worse than a trade war. On this episode, we speak with the one and only David Woo, now the founder of David Woo Unbound. He also previously served as the Head of Global Rates, Foreign Exchange, and EM Fixed Income and Economics Research at Bank of America. He says that the administration has absolutely nothing to show for its initial months in office on any front. And he says this isn't a game of chicken, where one side can blink and avoid disaster. Instead, we're seeing a "war of attrition" where damage is being done to both the US and Chinese economies as we speak. As he sees it, the China hawks in the administration have been in control, and have the impulse to obliterate the Chinese economy, which makes the situation more than just a so-called trade war. He discusses the political, market, and real economy implications of this dramatic escalation. Read more:Trump U-Turns on Powell, China Follow Dire Economic WarningsA Bad Peace in Ukraine Carries Global Risks Only Bloomberg - Business News, Stock Markets, Finance, Breaking & World News subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox each week, plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-24•49mins

#26

#27

Big Take: What a Bacon, Egg and Cheese Teaches Us About the Economy

When it comes to measuring economic pain, the cost of a humble breakfast sandwich might not be top of mind. But Bloomberg has an index that tracks the rising cost of a bacon, egg and cheese sandwich, plus a cup of coffee. And this year, it’s reached record highs.On today’s Big Take podcast, we hear from people up and down the BEC supply chain — from a wheat farmer to a coffee roaster to a guy who turned his life-long love of eggs into a career. What does the most important meal of the day tell us about inflation, supply and demand, and the complexities of financial markets? More importantly: how did this sandwich get so expensive?Like this episode? Listen and Subscribe to the Big Take podcast on Apple, Spotify, iHeart or wherever you get your podcastsOnly Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-23•22mins

Big Take: What a Bacon, Egg and Cheese Teaches Us About the Economy

When it comes to measuring economic pain, the cost of a humble breakfast sandwich might not be top of mind. But Bloomberg has an index that tracks the rising cost of a bacon, egg and cheese sandwich, plus a cup of coffee. And this year, it’s reached record highs.On today’s Big Take podcast, we hear from people up and down the BEC supply chain — from a wheat farmer to a coffee roaster to a guy who turned his life-long love of eggs into a career. What does the most important meal of the day tell us about inflation, supply and demand, and the complexities of financial markets? More importantly: how did this sandwich get so expensive?Like this episode? Listen and Subscribe to the Big Take podcast on Apple, Spotify, iHeart or wherever you get your podcastsOnly Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-23•22mins

#27

#28

This Is What President Biden's CHIPS Office Actually Did

One of the stated goals for the current trade war is to build more industrial capacity in the United States. So far there doesn't seem to be much of it happening. In fact, all of the manufacturing surveys (and all evidence) so far suggests the reverse. But not that long ago there was a concerted effort to build more factories in the United States. Under President Biden there was a whole host of new industrial announcements funded in part via the CHIPS Act and the Inflation Reduction Act. But did we get anything from these bills? Do we have anything to show for it? Why is building more capacity in the United States so difficult? On this episode, we spoke with Hassan Khan, who recently left his position as the director of economic security in the CHIPS Program Office at the Department of Commerce, about what he learned, what he saw, what could be done differently, and what the results are actually were.Read more:With US Chips Act Money Mostly Divvied Up, the Real Test BeginsTSMC’s Arizona Chip Production Yields Surpass Taiwan’sUS Chip Grants in Limbo as Lutnick Pushes Bigger Investments Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlots See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-23•48mins

This Is What President Biden's CHIPS Office Actually Did

One of the stated goals for the current trade war is to build more industrial capacity in the United States. So far there doesn't seem to be much of it happening. In fact, all of the manufacturing surveys (and all evidence) so far suggests the reverse. But not that long ago there was a concerted effort to build more factories in the United States. Under President Biden there was a whole host of new industrial announcements funded in part via the CHIPS Act and the Inflation Reduction Act. But did we get anything from these bills? Do we have anything to show for it? Why is building more capacity in the United States so difficult? On this episode, we spoke with Hassan Khan, who recently left his position as the director of economic security in the CHIPS Program Office at the Department of Commerce, about what he learned, what he saw, what could be done differently, and what the results are actually were.Read more:With US Chips Act Money Mostly Divvied Up, the Real Test BeginsTSMC’s Arizona Chip Production Yields Surpass Taiwan’sUS Chip Grants in Limbo as Lutnick Pushes Bigger Investments Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlots See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-23•48mins

#28

#29

Martin Wolf on Trump's Shakeup of the Global Order

Martin Wolf has been called one of the world's most important economics commentators, and has for decades written in columns and his own books about the evolution of the global economy, chronicling the rise of globalization and the subsequent pushback to liberal trade. And he's had a lot to write about in recent weeks. President Trump's unveiling of sweeping tariffs against pretty much every single US trading partner has not only roiled global markets, but is shaking up international politics as well. Countries around the world are now struggling to understand exactly what the Trump administration is trying to achieve, how far it will go in terms of its political and economic isolationism, and how they should we respond. On this episode we speak with Wolf, the chief economics commentator for the Financial Times, about what Trump's reordering of global trade means for the world, how Europe and China might respond, and the origins of the US administration's economic discontent.Read More: Trump’s Tariffs and China Collide to Shock the $115 Trillion Global EconomyWhat’s Left of Globalization Without the US? Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-21•1hr 2mins

Martin Wolf on Trump's Shakeup of the Global Order

Martin Wolf has been called one of the world's most important economics commentators, and has for decades written in columns and his own books about the evolution of the global economy, chronicling the rise of globalization and the subsequent pushback to liberal trade. And he's had a lot to write about in recent weeks. President Trump's unveiling of sweeping tariffs against pretty much every single US trading partner has not only roiled global markets, but is shaking up international politics as well. Countries around the world are now struggling to understand exactly what the Trump administration is trying to achieve, how far it will go in terms of its political and economic isolationism, and how they should we respond. On this episode we speak with Wolf, the chief economics commentator for the Financial Times, about what Trump's reordering of global trade means for the world, how Europe and China might respond, and the origins of the US administration's economic discontent.Read More: Trump’s Tariffs and China Collide to Shock the $115 Trillion Global EconomyWhat’s Left of Globalization Without the US? Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-21•1hr 2mins

#29

#30

Here's Why Uncertainty Is An Economic Killer

Here's Why is Bloomberg’s short explainer podcast, where we take one big news story and break it down in just a few minutes—with help from our experts across the newsroom. We're dropping into your feed with a special episode featuring Joe Weisenthal, co-host of Bloomberg’s Odd Lots podcast, who joined us while in London. In this episode: The near-daily shifts in U.S. trade policy have rattled markets and made both businesses and consumers uneasy about spending. What kind of damage does all this uncertainty cause to the economy? And is it something we’ll eventually get used to? Joe joins Stephen Carroll to break it all down. Like what you hear? Subscribe to the Here’s Why podcast for more quick, expert-driven explainers available via the links below every Friday. Apple Podcasts Spotify TuneIn iHeart RSS feed See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-20•10mins

Here's Why Uncertainty Is An Economic Killer

Here's Why is Bloomberg’s short explainer podcast, where we take one big news story and break it down in just a few minutes—with help from our experts across the newsroom. We're dropping into your feed with a special episode featuring Joe Weisenthal, co-host of Bloomberg’s Odd Lots podcast, who joined us while in London. In this episode: The near-daily shifts in U.S. trade policy have rattled markets and made both businesses and consumers uneasy about spending. What kind of damage does all this uncertainty cause to the economy? And is it something we’ll eventually get used to? Joe joins Stephen Carroll to break it all down. Like what you hear? Subscribe to the Here’s Why podcast for more quick, expert-driven explainers available via the links below every Friday. Apple Podcasts Spotify TuneIn iHeart RSS feed See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-20•10mins

#30

#31

Why the Pentagon Fails Audits Year After Year After Year

Last year, it was announced that the US Department of Defense had failed an audit for its seventh straight year, indicating an ongoing inability to track its hundreds of billions of dollars in spending and inventories. Why does this keep happening? Why does the Pentagon get audited in the first place? And what can be done to fix it? On this episode, we speak with Julia Gledhill, a research analyst at the National Security Reform Program at the Stimson Center. She explains how the budgetary process works, as well as the prospects for the Pentagon ever actually passing an audit. Read more:Pentagon Still Falls Short on Jump-Starting Innovation, Audit SaysBillionaire Feinberg Says Pentagon Needs an Investor’s Savvy Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox each week, plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-19•42mins

Why the Pentagon Fails Audits Year After Year After Year

Last year, it was announced that the US Department of Defense had failed an audit for its seventh straight year, indicating an ongoing inability to track its hundreds of billions of dollars in spending and inventories. Why does this keep happening? Why does the Pentagon get audited in the first place? And what can be done to fix it? On this episode, we speak with Julia Gledhill, a research analyst at the National Security Reform Program at the Stimson Center. She explains how the budgetary process works, as well as the prospects for the Pentagon ever actually passing an audit. Read more:Pentagon Still Falls Short on Jump-Starting Innovation, Audit SaysBillionaire Feinberg Says Pentagon Needs an Investor’s Savvy Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox each week, plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-19•42mins

#31

#32

Mitu Gulati on Whether Trump Could Restructure US Debt

US Treasuries are the most important market in the world. With some $29 trillion outstanding, they create the benchmark that informs basically every other type of borrowing. Any changes to how the bond market works would be a massive deal. But lately, there's been a lot of chatter about how the Trump administration could radically restructure and refinance the US debt under the so-called "Mar-a-Lago Accord." In this episode, we speak with University of Virginia law professor Mitu Gulati about how far the administration could go to legally reform this huge and important market. We also talk about how to buy Greenland and whether Trump could make a few billion by collecting on some old loans from allies. Read more:One Way for Trump to Find a Few Extra Trillion DollarsThe Stories We Tell Ourselves About Bonds Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox each week, plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-18•41mins

Mitu Gulati on Whether Trump Could Restructure US Debt

US Treasuries are the most important market in the world. With some $29 trillion outstanding, they create the benchmark that informs basically every other type of borrowing. Any changes to how the bond market works would be a massive deal. But lately, there's been a lot of chatter about how the Trump administration could radically restructure and refinance the US debt under the so-called "Mar-a-Lago Accord." In this episode, we speak with University of Virginia law professor Mitu Gulati about how far the administration could go to legally reform this huge and important market. We also talk about how to buy Greenland and whether Trump could make a few billion by collecting on some old loans from allies. Read more:One Way for Trump to Find a Few Extra Trillion DollarsThe Stories We Tell Ourselves About Bonds Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox each week, plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-18•41mins

#32

#33

Is This the End of the US Exceptionalism Trade?

For years and years now, there has been one winning trade: Go long the US versus the rest of the world. Thanks to tech dynamism and general pro-growth US macro policies, American assets have far outstripped their global peers. Of course, there have been some bumps along the way, but they've usually been global bumps. The financial crisis in 2008-2009 was global. Covid was a shock for the entire world. But with Trump's tariffs, we are now looking at a story that has the potential to be US-specific, even if a trade war will be felt internationally. And so investors are asking the question of whether US exceptionalism has come to an end, and there may be better opportunities elsewhere. On this episode we speak with Ozan Tarman, vice chair of global macro at Deutsche Bank. He tells us what his clients are thinking about and the various scenarios whereby US assets continue to underperform. We also discuss the implications of the US becoming more EM-like in its politics, and its financial markets.Read More: End of 'America First' Trade Is Boosting Europe's MarketsThe World Is Finding a Plausible Alternative to TreasuriesOnly Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-17•41mins

Is This the End of the US Exceptionalism Trade?

For years and years now, there has been one winning trade: Go long the US versus the rest of the world. Thanks to tech dynamism and general pro-growth US macro policies, American assets have far outstripped their global peers. Of course, there have been some bumps along the way, but they've usually been global bumps. The financial crisis in 2008-2009 was global. Covid was a shock for the entire world. But with Trump's tariffs, we are now looking at a story that has the potential to be US-specific, even if a trade war will be felt internationally. And so investors are asking the question of whether US exceptionalism has come to an end, and there may be better opportunities elsewhere. On this episode we speak with Ozan Tarman, vice chair of global macro at Deutsche Bank. He tells us what his clients are thinking about and the various scenarios whereby US assets continue to underperform. We also discuss the implications of the US becoming more EM-like in its politics, and its financial markets.Read More: End of 'America First' Trade Is Boosting Europe's MarketsThe World Is Finding a Plausible Alternative to TreasuriesOnly Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-17•41mins

#33

#34

Javier Blas on China's Rare Earths Dominance

Every time there is tension between the US and China, there are stories about China threatening to withhold exports of rare earth metals, which are supposedly crucial for all kinds of advanced technologies. In this episode, recorded in Bloomberg's London studio, Bloomberg Opinion columnist Javier Blas helps us clear up some misconceptions about them. For one thing, rare earths aren't actually that rare. Furthermore, the amount of global trade of these minerals is fairly minuscule. The US only imports $170 million worth in a year. And then beyond that, the most common usage of them is in vacuum cleaners. Still, their economics are interesting and they do have some important applications. In addition, we talk about what the trade war means for the domestic US energy agenda, and the Trump administration's desire to expand total output. Read more:Chinese Rare Earth Shipments Held Up as Trade War Upends ExportsJavier Blas: $50-a-Barrel Oil Is a Problem for US Trade Deficit Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-15•34mins

Javier Blas on China's Rare Earths Dominance

Every time there is tension between the US and China, there are stories about China threatening to withhold exports of rare earth metals, which are supposedly crucial for all kinds of advanced technologies. In this episode, recorded in Bloomberg's London studio, Bloomberg Opinion columnist Javier Blas helps us clear up some misconceptions about them. For one thing, rare earths aren't actually that rare. Furthermore, the amount of global trade of these minerals is fairly minuscule. The US only imports $170 million worth in a year. And then beyond that, the most common usage of them is in vacuum cleaners. Still, their economics are interesting and they do have some important applications. In addition, we talk about what the trade war means for the domestic US energy agenda, and the Trump administration's desire to expand total output. Read more:Chinese Rare Earth Shipments Held Up as Trade War Upends ExportsJavier Blas: $50-a-Barrel Oil Is a Problem for US Trade Deficit Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-15•34mins

#34

#35

What an American Stove Maker Wants You to Know About US Manufacturing

One of the ironies of the tariffs is that, while ostensibly the goal is to reshore US manufacturing, it's actually been US makers of physical goods themselves that have warned about the damage that trade barriers can cause. Or, to put it another way, if we really want to see more domestic US production in order to decouple from China, then perhaps there are other levers to pull besides the tariffs. On this episode of the podcast, we speak with Sam D'Amico, the founder and CEO of California-based Impulse Labs, which makes an amazing induction oven. We talk about what the tariffs mean for his business, and the various things, including capital markets and NIMBYism, that really stand as impediments to building out mass US production of goods. Read more:The High-Tech Stove That’s Also a Home BatteryEverything You Need to Know About the Basis Trade Spooking Markets Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox each week, plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-14•43mins

What an American Stove Maker Wants You to Know About US Manufacturing

One of the ironies of the tariffs is that, while ostensibly the goal is to reshore US manufacturing, it's actually been US makers of physical goods themselves that have warned about the damage that trade barriers can cause. Or, to put it another way, if we really want to see more domestic US production in order to decouple from China, then perhaps there are other levers to pull besides the tariffs. On this episode of the podcast, we speak with Sam D'Amico, the founder and CEO of California-based Impulse Labs, which makes an amazing induction oven. We talk about what the tariffs mean for his business, and the various things, including capital markets and NIMBYism, that really stand as impediments to building out mass US production of goods. Read more:The High-Tech Stove That’s Also a Home BatteryEverything You Need to Know About the Basis Trade Spooking Markets Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox each week, plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-14•43mins

#35

#36

Introducing: Stock Movers

Check out the new Stock Movers Podcast from Bloomberg. Subscribe for five-minute reports on today's winners and losers in the stock market. Listen on Apple: Listen on Spotify: Listen on other platforms: omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-13•6mins

Introducing: Stock Movers

Check out the new Stock Movers Podcast from Bloomberg. Subscribe for five-minute reports on today's winners and losers in the stock market. Listen on Apple: Listen on Spotify: Listen on other platforms: omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-13•6mins

#36

#37

Jim Chanos on Who's Getting Caught Swimming Naked

In a big bull market, people will overlook a lot. They'll suspend their disbelief. They'll buy into fantastical, unrealistic stories about the future. But when the momentum turns sharply the other way, all of this reverses. Then, as the cliché goes, you see who's been "swimming naked." So what have we learned from the recent market volatility? On this episode, we speak with legendary short-seller Jim Chanos, now the founder of Chanos & Co. We talk about cloud stocks and datacenters, AI, private equity, the Trump tariffs, and the strong evidence that Elon Musk isn't serious about tackling spending. Read more: Everything You Need to Know About the Basis Trade Spooking MarketsJim Chanos Says Biggest Risk for Markets Is DeepSeek-Like EventOnly Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-12•44mins

Jim Chanos on Who's Getting Caught Swimming Naked

In a big bull market, people will overlook a lot. They'll suspend their disbelief. They'll buy into fantastical, unrealistic stories about the future. But when the momentum turns sharply the other way, all of this reverses. Then, as the cliché goes, you see who's been "swimming naked." So what have we learned from the recent market volatility? On this episode, we speak with legendary short-seller Jim Chanos, now the founder of Chanos & Co. We talk about cloud stocks and datacenters, AI, private equity, the Trump tariffs, and the strong evidence that Elon Musk isn't serious about tackling spending. Read more: Everything You Need to Know About the Basis Trade Spooking MarketsJim Chanos Says Biggest Risk for Markets Is DeepSeek-Like EventOnly Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-12•44mins

#37

#38

Lots More on Why Neil Dutta Is Sticking With His Recession Call

On Wednesday, President Trump put a 90-day pause on reciprocal tariffs for every country except China. The market, which had been in a state of deep panic, surged massively on the announcement. But then on Thursday, stocks sold off hard again as people woke up to the reality of massive tariffs on China and the new baseline tariffs on everyone else. Plus, even before all this tariff drama, there were plenty of reasons to be anxious about the US economy. On this episode of Lots More, we speak with Neil Dutta of Renaissance Macro Research. He explains all the moving parts and why he's sticking with his call for a downturn this year.Mentioned on the show:Neil Dutta Sees Rising Risks to the Labor MarketEverything You Need to Know About the Basis Trade Spooking Markets Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-11•15mins

Lots More on Why Neil Dutta Is Sticking With His Recession Call

On Wednesday, President Trump put a 90-day pause on reciprocal tariffs for every country except China. The market, which had been in a state of deep panic, surged massively on the announcement. But then on Thursday, stocks sold off hard again as people woke up to the reality of massive tariffs on China and the new baseline tariffs on everyone else. Plus, even before all this tariff drama, there were plenty of reasons to be anxious about the US economy. On this episode of Lots More, we speak with Neil Dutta of Renaissance Macro Research. He explains all the moving parts and why he's sticking with his call for a downturn this year.Mentioned on the show:Neil Dutta Sees Rising Risks to the Labor MarketEverything You Need to Know About the Basis Trade Spooking Markets Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-11•15mins

#38

#39

Rob Kaplan on How the Fed Will Think about the Tariffs

On Wednesday, Trump pulled back from the brink on most of the reciprocal tariffs announced on April 2. The market surged. But we're still in an extraordinarily challenging moment. We have new across-the-board tariffs. We have gigantic tariffs on China. And there's a possibility that a recession has already begun. So what does the Fed do in this environment, with so much persistent uncertainty? On this episode, we speak with Rob Kaplan, former President of the Dallas Fed, and now the Vice Chairman of Goldman Sachs. We talk about the extreme uncertainty, the unusual behavior in the market, and what this all means for the energy sector. Read more:Fed Officials Worried Over Stagflation Risk Ahead of TariffsWall Street Chatter Grows That Fed May Act If Bond Rout Worsens Only subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox each week, plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-10•35mins

Rob Kaplan on How the Fed Will Think about the Tariffs

On Wednesday, Trump pulled back from the brink on most of the reciprocal tariffs announced on April 2. The market surged. But we're still in an extraordinarily challenging moment. We have new across-the-board tariffs. We have gigantic tariffs on China. And there's a possibility that a recession has already begun. So what does the Fed do in this environment, with so much persistent uncertainty? On this episode, we speak with Rob Kaplan, former President of the Dallas Fed, and now the Vice Chairman of Goldman Sachs. We talk about the extreme uncertainty, the unusual behavior in the market, and what this all means for the energy sector. Read more:Fed Officials Worried Over Stagflation Risk Ahead of TariffsWall Street Chatter Grows That Fed May Act If Bond Rout Worsens Only subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox each week, plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-10•35mins

#39

#40

Viktor Shvets on Trump's Historical, Revolutionary Moves

How should we make sense of the Trump tariffs? They've been terrible for the stock market, obviously. Small businesses seem to hate them. Energy companies aren't fans either. US manufacturers are talking about how the tariffs will make manufacturing harder. And yet we have them. So who stands to benefit? What's the point? And how should we understand this moment in American history? On this episode we speak with one of our favorite guests, Viktor Shvets, the head of global desk strategy at Macquarie Capital. Shvets has been warning for a long time about how US history is at a pivot point, with the neoliberal consensus coming to an end. He talks about Trump's revolutionary efforts to remake American society, the attendant shredding of norms, and what it all means for the globally-held view of American exceptionalism. Read More: Viktor Shvets on Why This Time Really Is DifferentThings Are Getting Pretty Weird in Markets Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-09•34mins

Viktor Shvets on Trump's Historical, Revolutionary Moves

How should we make sense of the Trump tariffs? They've been terrible for the stock market, obviously. Small businesses seem to hate them. Energy companies aren't fans either. US manufacturers are talking about how the tariffs will make manufacturing harder. And yet we have them. So who stands to benefit? What's the point? And how should we understand this moment in American history? On this episode we speak with one of our favorite guests, Viktor Shvets, the head of global desk strategy at Macquarie Capital. Shvets has been warning for a long time about how US history is at a pivot point, with the neoliberal consensus coming to an end. He talks about Trump's revolutionary efforts to remake American society, the attendant shredding of norms, and what it all means for the globally-held view of American exceptionalism. Read More: Viktor Shvets on Why This Time Really Is DifferentThings Are Getting Pretty Weird in Markets Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-09•34mins

#40

#41

What Tariffs Are Doing to North American Freight

Amidst Trump's dramatic tariff moves, trade in North America remains uncertain. The USMCA hasn't been completely ripped up, but the region is anxiously anticipating a new trade regime. As such, shippers and carriers dealing with North American freight are in a state of limbo, waiting to see how it all shakes out. In this episode, we speak with experienced freight broker Matt Silver, now the CEO of Cargado, a company that sells logistics software to businesses dealing with US-Mexico trade. We talk about the strategies being used right now, what's changing, what truckers are doing, and how all players may adapt to the new reality. Read more:Canada and Mexico, Early Trump Targets, Dodge the Worst of New Tariff SalvoThe Freight Recession Isn't Going Anywhere Now Only Bloomberg - Business News, Stock Markets, Finance, Breaking & World News subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox each week, plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-08•23mins

What Tariffs Are Doing to North American Freight

Amidst Trump's dramatic tariff moves, trade in North America remains uncertain. The USMCA hasn't been completely ripped up, but the region is anxiously anticipating a new trade regime. As such, shippers and carriers dealing with North American freight are in a state of limbo, waiting to see how it all shakes out. In this episode, we speak with experienced freight broker Matt Silver, now the CEO of Cargado, a company that sells logistics software to businesses dealing with US-Mexico trade. We talk about the strategies being used right now, what's changing, what truckers are doing, and how all players may adapt to the new reality. Read more:Canada and Mexico, Early Trump Targets, Dodge the Worst of New Tariff SalvoThe Freight Recession Isn't Going Anywhere Now Only Bloomberg - Business News, Stock Markets, Finance, Breaking & World News subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox each week, plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-08•23mins

#41

#42

What Trump's Tariffs Are Already Doing to World Trade

It was just last Wednesday that President Trump announced his new tariff schedule with the rest of the world. And it's already having an effect. Companies are scrambling to get goods on planes or boats to beat the first deadline. Companies are already trying to get out of existing contracts. And some previously planned factory endeavors have even been put on hold. On this episode, we speak with Ryan Petersen, the founder and CEO of Flexport, to talk about what he's already seeing from the perspective of his business. We also talk about how tariffs are operationally implemented, and how things might change if the existing tariffs remain in place.Read More: Tariffs Are Dragging Down Even Companies Without US ExportsJeep Maker Stellantis Offers to Help Suppliers Pay Tariff CostsOnly Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-07•26mins

What Trump's Tariffs Are Already Doing to World Trade

It was just last Wednesday that President Trump announced his new tariff schedule with the rest of the world. And it's already having an effect. Companies are scrambling to get goods on planes or boats to beat the first deadline. Companies are already trying to get out of existing contracts. And some previously planned factory endeavors have even been put on hold. On this episode, we speak with Ryan Petersen, the founder and CEO of Flexport, to talk about what he's already seeing from the perspective of his business. We also talk about how tariffs are operationally implemented, and how things might change if the existing tariffs remain in place.Read More: Tariffs Are Dragging Down Even Companies Without US ExportsJeep Maker Stellantis Offers to Help Suppliers Pay Tariff CostsOnly Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-07•26mins

#42

#43

Tether's CEO Speaks on His Insanely Profitable Business

Anything crypto-related is frequently greeted with a high degree of skepticism. Within that, one of the most controversial companies for a long time has been Tether, the company behind the popular stablecoin USDT. But despite people predicting otherwise, the company has boomed. It's insanely profitable. It's one of the largest holders of US Treasuries in the world. And because of the change in the US administration, it's gathering fans in Washington, DC. In this episode, we speak with Tether CEO Paolo Ardoino about what it's like to run this business, how they work with law enforcement, future growth opportunities, and why, after all these years, it's still never had a formal audit. Read more:What Are Stablecoins and Why Are Regulators Wary?Tether To Buy a 30% Stake in Italian Media Company Be Water Only Bloomberg - Business News, Stock Markets, Finance, Breaking & World News subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox each week, plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-07•48mins

Tether's CEO Speaks on His Insanely Profitable Business

Anything crypto-related is frequently greeted with a high degree of skepticism. Within that, one of the most controversial companies for a long time has been Tether, the company behind the popular stablecoin USDT. But despite people predicting otherwise, the company has boomed. It's insanely profitable. It's one of the largest holders of US Treasuries in the world. And because of the change in the US administration, it's gathering fans in Washington, DC. In this episode, we speak with Tether CEO Paolo Ardoino about what it's like to run this business, how they work with law enforcement, future growth opportunities, and why, after all these years, it's still never had a formal audit. Read more:What Are Stablecoins and Why Are Regulators Wary?Tether To Buy a 30% Stake in Italian Media Company Be Water Only Bloomberg - Business News, Stock Markets, Finance, Breaking & World News subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox each week, plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-07•48mins

#43

#44

Brad Setser on the Damage From Trump's Gigantic Tariff Shock

He needs no introduction: When trade is in the news, we speak with Brad Setser of the Council on Foreign Relations. Brad has been talking for awhile about the major imbalances of world trade, and the US-China relationship in particular. However, rather than building up a large trading bloc with our allies to counter Chinese influence, the Trump administration has chosen a path of going it alone, targeting friend and foe alike with large and wide-ranging tariffs. In this episode, we talk about the significance of the move, the potential damage, and what, if any, positive scenarios could result.Read More:Global Recession Fears Engulf Wall Street on Tariff RetaliationMatt Levine: The Tariffs Have Some Math Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-05•31mins

Brad Setser on the Damage From Trump's Gigantic Tariff Shock

He needs no introduction: When trade is in the news, we speak with Brad Setser of the Council on Foreign Relations. Brad has been talking for awhile about the major imbalances of world trade, and the US-China relationship in particular. However, rather than building up a large trading bloc with our allies to counter Chinese influence, the Trump administration has chosen a path of going it alone, targeting friend and foe alike with large and wide-ranging tariffs. In this episode, we talk about the significance of the move, the potential damage, and what, if any, positive scenarios could result.Read More:Global Recession Fears Engulf Wall Street on Tariff RetaliationMatt Levine: The Tariffs Have Some Math Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-05•31mins

#44

#45

Lots More on a Massive, Historical, Stagflationary Shock

On Wednesday, President Trump unveiled sweeping tariffs against almost every country in the world. The size and scope was far beyond what anyone was anticipating, causing markets to subsequently plunge. But what's next? Could it work out for the US? Will we see a spike in inflation? Will the global trading system continue to operate? On this episode, we speak with Tom Orlik, the chief economist for Bloomberg Economics, on the historical nature of this stagflationary shock, and what happens to the US and global economies if these numbers remain in place.Read More:Economists Slash US Growth, Boost Inflation Forecasts on TariffsGermany and France Push for More Aggressive Tariff Response Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-04•23mins

Lots More on a Massive, Historical, Stagflationary Shock

On Wednesday, President Trump unveiled sweeping tariffs against almost every country in the world. The size and scope was far beyond what anyone was anticipating, causing markets to subsequently plunge. But what's next? Could it work out for the US? Will we see a spike in inflation? Will the global trading system continue to operate? On this episode, we speak with Tom Orlik, the chief economist for Bloomberg Economics, on the historical nature of this stagflationary shock, and what happens to the US and global economies if these numbers remain in place.Read More:Economists Slash US Growth, Boost Inflation Forecasts on TariffsGermany and France Push for More Aggressive Tariff Response Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-04•23mins

#45

#46

Tim Geithner on How to Fight the Next Financial Crisis

The 2008 financial crisis is fading into history, but the risks of something big happening again remain. In this episode, we speak with Tim Geithner, the former US Treasury secretary and head of the New York Fed during the tumultuous collapse of Lehman Brothers. The conversation coincides with the launch of Yale's New Bagehot Project, which is aimed at guiding the next generation of financial crisis-fighters (Geithner is Chair of the program on financial stability at the Yale University School of Management). We talk about what's most important when it comes to putting out financial fires, and what could have been done differently during 2008. And of course, we also talk current risks in the financial system. Read more:US Debt Load Tops Fed’s Survey of Financial Stability RisksFiscal Debt Binge Is World’s Biggest Stability Threat, BIS SaysSubprime Collapse to Global Financial Meltdown: Timeline Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox each week, plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-03•47mins

Tim Geithner on How to Fight the Next Financial Crisis

The 2008 financial crisis is fading into history, but the risks of something big happening again remain. In this episode, we speak with Tim Geithner, the former US Treasury secretary and head of the New York Fed during the tumultuous collapse of Lehman Brothers. The conversation coincides with the launch of Yale's New Bagehot Project, which is aimed at guiding the next generation of financial crisis-fighters (Geithner is Chair of the program on financial stability at the Yale University School of Management). We talk about what's most important when it comes to putting out financial fires, and what could have been done differently during 2008. And of course, we also talk current risks in the financial system. Read more:US Debt Load Tops Fed’s Survey of Financial Stability RisksFiscal Debt Binge Is World’s Biggest Stability Threat, BIS SaysSubprime Collapse to Global Financial Meltdown: Timeline Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox each week, plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-03•47mins

#46

#47

The Growing Risk to Fed Independence That Wall St Isn't Watching

Last month, Donald Trump fired the Federal Trade Commission's two Democratic commissioners. They have since filed suit, arguing that the law that created the FTC — as well as a 90-year-old Supreme Court precedent — prevent the president from firing them without cause. And now, what might seem like a niche legal dispute could end up having much bigger consequences for other independent government agencies, including the Federal Reserve. That would be a huge shock for Wall Street, which tends to value central bank independence. In this episode, we speak with Lev Menand, professor at Columbia Law School and author of The Fed Unbound, to talk about the huge stakes involved in this case.Read More:Trump and the Fed Are on a Collision CourseWho Will Protect the Fed’s Independence? The Markets Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-01•39mins

The Growing Risk to Fed Independence That Wall St Isn't Watching

Last month, Donald Trump fired the Federal Trade Commission's two Democratic commissioners. They have since filed suit, arguing that the law that created the FTC — as well as a 90-year-old Supreme Court precedent — prevent the president from firing them without cause. And now, what might seem like a niche legal dispute could end up having much bigger consequences for other independent government agencies, including the Federal Reserve. That would be a huge shock for Wall Street, which tends to value central bank independence. In this episode, we speak with Lev Menand, professor at Columbia Law School and author of The Fed Unbound, to talk about the huge stakes involved in this case.Read More:Trump and the Fed Are on a Collision CourseWho Will Protect the Fed’s Independence? The Markets Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-04-01•39mins

#47

#48

Nick Denton's Big Bet Against the United States

Legendary media mogul Nick Denton, the founder of Gawker, is done with the US. He’s leaving New York City for good, and moving with his family to the Buda Hills near Budapest. And when it comes to his stock portfolio, he’s done with the US as well. On this episode of the podcast, he tells us why he’s bullish on China, and says that the fall of Elon Musk may be the biggest business story in the entire world. We also talk about the end of the Atlanticist dream, why European elites are turning so sharply against the US, and his investment approach.Read more: BYD Sales Top Tesla as Tech Focus Wins Over Chinese DriversXiaomi Plans to Expand Beijing EV Factory to Meet Surging Demand Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-03-31•49mins

Nick Denton's Big Bet Against the United States

Legendary media mogul Nick Denton, the founder of Gawker, is done with the US. He’s leaving New York City for good, and moving with his family to the Buda Hills near Budapest. And when it comes to his stock portfolio, he’s done with the US as well. On this episode of the podcast, he tells us why he’s bullish on China, and says that the fall of Elon Musk may be the biggest business story in the entire world. We also talk about the end of the Atlanticist dream, why European elites are turning so sharply against the US, and his investment approach.Read more: BYD Sales Top Tesla as Tech Focus Wins Over Chinese DriversXiaomi Plans to Expand Beijing EV Factory to Meet Surging Demand Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-03-31•49mins

#48

#49

The Last Time Investors Really Got Excited For Tech Infrastructure

One of the biggest questions hanging over the market right now is whether or not the seemingly unlimited appetite for more AI data center spending is slowing down or not. This type of tech infrastructure has been a massive sectoral winner over the last few years. But of course, this isn't the first time investors have gotten excited about this type of trade. The late 1990s and early 2000s are often remembered as being the time of a "tech bubble" or "dot-com bubble," but one specific aspect was the buildout in broadband infrastructure, or what became known as the telecom bubble. So what was that all about? Why were investors so optimistic? And how did it end? At our recent live episode in Washington DC, we spoke with Blair Levin, policy adviser to New Street Research. He was the chief of staff at the FCC during the telecom deregulation of the 1990s, and in the early 2000s went to work on Wall Street. He tells us about differences and similarities between then and now, plus the signs of when the ride is coming to an end.Read More: What It Felt Like When Everyone Was Hopeful, Happy, and Rich Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-03-28•33mins

The Last Time Investors Really Got Excited For Tech Infrastructure

One of the biggest questions hanging over the market right now is whether or not the seemingly unlimited appetite for more AI data center spending is slowing down or not. This type of tech infrastructure has been a massive sectoral winner over the last few years. But of course, this isn't the first time investors have gotten excited about this type of trade. The late 1990s and early 2000s are often remembered as being the time of a "tech bubble" or "dot-com bubble," but one specific aspect was the buildout in broadband infrastructure, or what became known as the telecom bubble. So what was that all about? Why were investors so optimistic? And how did it end? At our recent live episode in Washington DC, we spoke with Blair Levin, policy adviser to New Street Research. He was the chief of staff at the FCC during the telecom deregulation of the 1990s, and in the early 2000s went to work on Wall Street. He tells us about differences and similarities between then and now, plus the signs of when the ride is coming to an end.Read More: What It Felt Like When Everyone Was Hopeful, Happy, and Rich Only Bloomberg.com subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox — now delivered every weekday — plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-03-28•33mins

#49

#50

Why Brad Jacobs Is Spending $11 Billion on a Roofing Supply Business

Brad Jacobs has made a fortune in his career buying and building big logistics companies, like United Rentals, Waste Management, XPO (trucking company), GXO (warehouses), and RXO (freight brokerage). His current venture is QXO, which raised billions of dollars in order to enter the building supply industry. After a long search and a couple months of battling with the executive team, QXO announced last week that it would be acquiring publicly traded roofing supply company Beacon Roofing for $11 billion. So why expand into roofing supply? And why Beacon specifically? We sat down with Brad to talk about the roofing industry, his vision for improving the company, what other opportunities are out there, and what he's seeing in the general economy right now. Read more:QXO Agrees to Acquire Beacon Roofing Supply in $11 Billion DealAffordable Housing Developers Stalled by Blocked Federal Funds Only subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox each week, plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-03-27•47mins

Why Brad Jacobs Is Spending $11 Billion on a Roofing Supply Business

Brad Jacobs has made a fortune in his career buying and building big logistics companies, like United Rentals, Waste Management, XPO (trucking company), GXO (warehouses), and RXO (freight brokerage). His current venture is QXO, which raised billions of dollars in order to enter the building supply industry. After a long search and a couple months of battling with the executive team, QXO announced last week that it would be acquiring publicly traded roofing supply company Beacon Roofing for $11 billion. So why expand into roofing supply? And why Beacon specifically? We sat down with Brad to talk about the roofing industry, his vision for improving the company, what other opportunities are out there, and what he's seeing in the general economy right now. Read more:QXO Agrees to Acquire Beacon Roofing Supply in $11 Billion DealAffordable Housing Developers Stalled by Blocked Federal Funds Only subscribers can get the Odd Lots newsletter in their inbox each week, plus unlimited access to the site and app. Subscribe at bloomberg.com/subscriptions/oddlotsSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2025-03-27•47mins

#50

Listen to your favourite podcasts.

Now ad-free.

Download herd and enjoy uninterrupted, high-quality podcasts without the wait.

Download on the

App Store

Podcast Summary

Why It's So Hard for Apple to Move Production from China to India

Why It's So Hard for Apple to Move Production from China to India

How Do We Define a Currency?

How Do We Define a Currency?

Krishna Memani on Wall Street's Very Expensive "Free Lunch"

Krishna Memani on Wall Street's Very Expensive "Free Lunch"

Michael Cembalest on Why AI Is the Stock Market Bet of the Century

Michael Cembalest on Why AI Is the Stock Market Bet of the Century

Why Asset Allocators Love Multi-Strategy Hedge Funds

Why Asset Allocators Love Multi-Strategy Hedge Funds

Zohran Mamdani, the Socialist Who Could Be NYC's New Mayor

Zohran Mamdani, the Socialist Who Could Be NYC's New Mayor

Why Interest Rates Are Shooting Up All Around the World

Why Interest Rates Are Shooting Up All Around the World

Scott Bok on How Bankers Spread the Gospel of Capitalism

Scott Bok on How Bankers Spread the Gospel of Capitalism

Listen to your favourite podcasts.

Atlanta Fed's Raphael Bostic on Monetary Policy During Extreme Uncertainty

Atlanta Fed's Raphael Bostic on Monetary Policy During Extreme Uncertainty

The Oil Industry's Double Whammy of Higher Costs and Lower Prices

The Oil Industry's Double Whammy of Higher Costs and Lower Prices

Perry Mehrling on Trump's Echoes of the Nixon Shock

Perry Mehrling on Trump's Echoes of the Nixon Shock

Philip Diehl on the Booming Business of Gold Coins

Philip Diehl on the Booming Business of Gold Coins

Why the World Keeps Getting Shocked by China's Technological Progress

Why the World Keeps Getting Shocked by China's Technological Progress

Sarah LaFleur On the Existential Threat From the Tariffs

Sarah LaFleur On the Existential Threat From the Tariffs

How China Might Actually Handle a US Trade War

How China Might Actually Handle a US Trade War

The Tariff Buzzsaw Is Coming For Hardcore Gamers

The Tariff Buzzsaw Is Coming For Hardcore Gamers

Brad Setser on the Big Surge in the Taiwanese Dollar

Brad Setser on the Big Surge in the Taiwanese Dollar

Henry Blodget on AI, Dot-Coms, and What's Changed In 25 Years

Henry Blodget on AI, Dot-Coms, and What's Changed In 25 Years

Chris Hughes on How to Craft a Thriving Market

Chris Hughes on How to Craft a Thriving Market

What The 'Lentil King of Saskatchewan' Knows About World Trade

What The 'Lentil King of Saskatchewan' Knows About World Trade

Blackstone's King of Hedge Funds on Alt Investing Right Now

Blackstone's King of Hedge Funds on Alt Investing Right Now

Some of America's Most Important Economic Data Is Decaying

Some of America's Most Important Economic Data Is Decaying

What We Learned About Treasuries on the Night of April 8

What We Learned About Treasuries on the Night of April 8

Listen to your favourite podcasts.

Lots More on How TikTok Options Traders Got Quiet

Lots More on How TikTok Options Traders Got Quiet

Anna Wong: Empty Shelves Are Coming Soon

Anna Wong: Empty Shelves Are Coming Soon

David Woo: What Trump Started is Worse Than a Trade War

David Woo: What Trump Started is Worse Than a Trade War

Big Take: What a Bacon, Egg and Cheese Teaches Us About the Economy

Big Take: What a Bacon, Egg and Cheese Teaches Us About the Economy

This Is What President Biden's CHIPS Office Actually Did

This Is What President Biden's CHIPS Office Actually Did

Martin Wolf on Trump's Shakeup of the Global Order

Martin Wolf on Trump's Shakeup of the Global Order

Here's Why Uncertainty Is An Economic Killer

Here's Why Uncertainty Is An Economic Killer

Why the Pentagon Fails Audits Year After Year After Year

Why the Pentagon Fails Audits Year After Year After Year

Mitu Gulati on Whether Trump Could Restructure US Debt

Mitu Gulati on Whether Trump Could Restructure US Debt

Is This the End of the US Exceptionalism Trade?

Is This the End of the US Exceptionalism Trade?

Javier Blas on China's Rare Earths Dominance

Javier Blas on China's Rare Earths Dominance

What an American Stove Maker Wants You to Know About US Manufacturing

What an American Stove Maker Wants You to Know About US Manufacturing

Introducing: Stock Movers

Introducing: Stock Movers

Jim Chanos on Who's Getting Caught Swimming Naked

Jim Chanos on Who's Getting Caught Swimming Naked

Lots More on Why Neil Dutta Is Sticking With His Recession Call

Lots More on Why Neil Dutta Is Sticking With His Recession Call