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More or Less

ByDave Morin, Jessica Lessin, Brit Morin, and Sam Lessin
102 episodes

Podcast Summary

Dave Morin, Jessica Lessin, Brit Morin, and Sam Lessin have debated the future of Silicon Valley and tech as the closest of friends for the last 15 years. Now six companies, two venture funds and more than a decade at Google, Apple and Facebook later, they are opening up the debate. From The Information, Offline Ventures, and Slow Ventures. Follow the crew: http://x.com/davemorin http://x.com/brit http://x.com/lessin http:/x.com/jessicalessin Follow the pod: https://moreorlesspod.com/ http://youtube.com/moreorlesspod https://x.com/moreorlesspod

#1

#101: The Business of OnlyFans, Future of Identity, and Navigating Privacy in the AI Age

This week on More or Less: Investors too squeamish for OnlyFans, AI makes the creator economy weirder (and richer), and why your next ETF might be Mormon. Plus, the real reason nobody watches your full podcast, and a healthy dose of tech industry self-roasting. TakeawaysOnlyFans presents a unique investment opportunity despite its controversial nature.Market dynamics in the sex work industry are shifting due to platforms like OnlyFans.Investment perspectives on controversial industries are evolving with societal changes.Digital identity verification is becoming increasingly important in the tech landscape.AI is transforming content creation and user interaction on platforms like OnlyFans.The need for robust age verification systems is critical for online safety.Social engineering poses significant risks to digital security and identity verification.The intersection of technology and privacy raises important ethical questions.New technologies are emerging to address identity verification challenges. Cybersecurity is a growing concern in today's digital age.Personal security measures are becoming increasingly important.The evolution of media is leading to new forms of content consumption.Platforms like TBPN are disrupting traditional media models.Cultural shifts are changing the landscape of digital content.Celebrity ventures are becoming significant players in the market.The importance of remembering complex passwords cannot be overstated.Media companies must adapt to the soundbite era to stay relevant.Tech hiring is experiencing a downturn post-pandemic.The de-stigmatization of platforms like OnlyFans is creating new opportunities.We’re also on ↓X: with us here:Sam Lessin: Morin: Lessin: Morin: Celebrating Milestones and Listener Engagement03:00 The Business of OnlyFans and Its Market Dynamics05:58 Investment Perspectives on Controversial Industries09:04 The Evolution of Digital Identity and Security12:00 The Intersection of Technology and Privacy14:59 The Future...

2025-05-30•56mins
#2

#100: OpenAI Teams Up with Jony Ive, Vibe Coding, Gemini, and More

This week, Sam and Dave are joined by a very special guest: Synthetic Fidji. Yes, an AI version of Fidji Simo, created after the real one politely declined (hey, the show must go on, okay?).They get into:the bull and bear case for vibe codingGemini vs. GPT (is Sam having second thoughts?)why GitHub might be quietly, ruthlessly winning the AI dev racethe identity crisis no one’s cracked with LLMsPlus: OpenAI just spent $6 billion on hardware to team up with Jony Ive, the MEO phone is suddenly everywhere, and more.We’re also on ↓X: with us here:Sam Lessin: Morin: Lessin: Morin: Introduction01:24 OpenAI CEO of Applications?07:55 Tools that ACTUALLY work18:47 Is everyone lying about vibe coding?43:10 The big identity problem with LLMs (and Zapier)52:26 Google I/O: "Who cares?"54:13 Is OpenAI big tech? They buy Jony Ive's startup56:17 The "hyper-viral" Methaphone. How?59:40 Outro

2025-05-23•1hr 0mins
#3

#99: The Airbnb Strategy Nobody’s Talking About

What happens when Sam gets fed up with shady secondary brokers mid-recording? He starts vibe coding a platform to replace them—live on the pod!On this week’s More or Less, the gang dives deep into the messy mechanics of the secondary markets and how early cashouts might be a bigger red flag than anyone wants to admit.Plus:Airbnb’s déjà vu product strategyThe quiet crisis in venture liquidity (and who’s actually good at selling)OpenAI’s new “CEO of Applications”, andThe looming threat of Trump’s nonprofit tax crackdown (and what it means for Harvard, endowments, and… Froyo)We’re also on ↓X: with us here:1) Sam Lessin: Dave Morin: Jessica Lessin: Brit Morin:

2025-05-16•49mins
#4

#98: OpenAI Acquires Windsurf for $3B, Google's Stock Dips

The countdown to Episode 100 is on, but this week, it's more news and less Sam.Jessica, Brit, and Dave dig into a jam-packed week across tech, AI, VC, and culture—starting with Dave topping a surprise list of top angel investors (yes, above Peter Thiel), raising questions about who really shows up on cap tables and why no women made the cut.The crew unpack:Windsurf’s $3B acquisition by OpenAIApple’s potential move to replace Google with its own AI search in SafariA historic week of M&A with DoorDash, Datadog, and Function Health, andWhy tech was (mostly) absent from this year’s Met GalaWe’re also on ↓X: with us here:1) Sam Lessin: Dave Morin: Jessica Lessin: Brit Morin: Trailer01:24 Nearly 100 episodes02:35 Top one angel investor: David Morin07:22 Big M&As and vibe coding20:09 Digital media22:09 Is Google search dying?30:13 New Netflix interface32:18 Fund entities and structures (Sam, don't listen!)44:37 Pop culture corner: Barry Diller46:20 Pop culture corner: Met Gala54:44 Happy birthday to Jess55:26 Outro

2025-05-09•56mins
#5

#97: How OpenAI Is Beating Google and Meta at Their Own Game

Jess, Sam, Brit, and Dave are back on More or Less with plenty to unpack—from Meta and Google’s AI sprawl to Snap’s fading relevance and the monetization questions hanging over tech.Here’s what they get into:– Why OpenAI is crushing the consumer AI game– Sam’s new startup: The Ruck Rock fitness empire– Meta’s AI app confusion (and Ray-Ban power moves)– Snap’s ad crash—and a left-field fix involving Sam Altman– AI and mental health: the risks no one’s talking aboutPlus: the parenting trick Meghan Markle and Sam both swear by—and why Dave might soon be replaced by an AI on the board.We’re also on ↓X: with us here:1) Sam Lessin: Dave Morin: Jessica Lessin: Brit Morin: Trailer01:20 AI investors, New York, Austin05:01 The Ruck Rock, Methaphone, Weighted Tungsten cases11:02 Meta AI, Google Gemini, ChatGPT21:46 The way to win in AI31:39 Snap snapped, and macroeconomics too34:29 Thinking Machines Lab38:21 AI and mental health45:32 Pop culture: Beyonce, Warriors, Meghan Markle48:56 Outro

2025-05-02•49mins
#6

#96: Google & Meta on Trial, Tesla, AI & Media

Jess, Sam, Brit, and Dave returned from spring break to catch up on chaotic headlines from the last week — from Tesla’s bad quarter to Google’s courtroom drama.On the docket:– the antitrust cases shaking up Google, Meta, and the entire ad economy – is OpenAI quietly building the next Facebook? – Sam’s theory on “zombiecorns” – is OnlyFans the new Uber?We’re also on ↓X: with us here:1) Sam Lessin: Dave Morin: Jessica Lessin: Brit Morin: Trailer01:25 Recruiting PMs and hard-to-fake filters08:34 Google anti-trust legal theater13:58 Market narratives and fruit monopolies22:21 LLMs and media companies25:49 Is the web dying?32:05 People want resonance38:19 Adult content and AI40:59 Meme stock Tesla and messiah Elon47:30 How Musk handles the poliola49:15 "Spam" Lessin's factory-farmed VC unicorn end52:23 National medal of motherhood55:48 Be the mountain, not the storm58:10 Outro and announcement

2025-04-25•59mins
#7

#95: OpenAI’s Social Network & Figma’s Potential IPO

With Jess and Sam taking the week off Brit and Dave are joined by two leading voices in venture and tech: Ben Lerer (Managing Partner, Lerer Hippeau) and Morgan Beller (General Partner, NFX; Co-creator of Libra). Together, they dive into the shifting tides of tech, venture, and AI:– OpenAI’s next move: A social network?– Venture’s broken math– The ‘AI’ label inflation, and– Figma’s IPO and what it signals for techPlus, Ben and Morgan weigh space travel risks—would you commit to a ticket to Mars?Let us know in the comments below!00:00 Trailer01:16 Guest Intro03:39 VC East Coast scene08:39 Offline from tech10:32 OpenAI social media leak? 15:08 Investing in AI22:59 Like AI companies28:49 Figma's Potentital IPO33:08 LPs and founders are pissed41:52 Pop culture corner: Katy Perry went to space45:02 Humans on Mars by 2040? 46:36 OutroFeaturing: Ben Lerer: Beller: also on ↓X: with us here:1) Sam Lessin: Dave Morin: Jessica Lessin: Brit Morin:

2025-04-18•48mins
#8

#94: Will Elon Quit DC? Trump’s Chaos & AI’s China Threat (with Joanna Coles)

This week on More or Less, Jessica hosts with Joanna Coles, Chief Content Officer at The Daily Beast, while Sam, Dave, and Brit are off for “spring break”!They explore:• Elon’s DC stint• Trump’s cabinet leaks: Leaks fuel Rubio-Elon tension• China’s AI edge: Cheap tech shakes Valley’s leadPlus, Joanna ponders plastic surgery risks in space—will implants hold up?Featuring: Joanna Coles: Daily Beast: also on ↓X: with us here:1) Sam Lessin: Dave Morin: Jessica Lessin: Brit Morin: The only one standing felt abandoned03:05 Guest intro04:36 What's it like inside the newsroom frontlines07:03 Betrayal, greed, power, ambition, love...12:17 What character is Elon Musk playing20:25 The Donald, the Valley, and the Trade War28:29 What the insider insiders are talking about31:20 Space, plastic surgeons, celebrities37:06 Another pop culture moment: Meghan Sussex40:52 Royalty and the tabloid46:05 Gloria Steinem, women's rights, reproductive health48:23 Moments that break out51:46 Outro

2025-04-11•54mins

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#9

#93: Can Tesla Survive?

This week on More or Less: Tesla reports a steep drop in deliveries, investor confidence wavers, and BYD continues to close in. The crew also dives into:Elon’s "Fake News": More Drama, Less DOGEOpenAI’s record-breaking $40B raiseTikTok’s algo standoff, andThe UFC’s deal with MetaPlus: Brit’s True Crime fascination with the Deel v. Rippling spy story!We’re also on ↓X: with us here:1) Sam Lessin: Dave Morin: Jessica Lessin: Brit Morin: Trailer01:03 Sam and Dave's clones02:59 Are we getting closer or further away from Mars?05:58 Tesla Drama13:36 Elon News fatigue18:13 Dave social middle ground and drunk Sam20:20 Everyone’s vibe coding24:13 OpenAI28:03 Costs vs potential monetization46:43 Rippling v. Deel James Bond Spying49:56 UFC × Meta51:41 Outro

2025-04-04•52mins
#10

#92: The Signal Scandal & DOGE Drama! (with Ben Smith and Nicholas Carlson)

The debate is heating up—DC and Silicon Valley are deeply split over DOGE. This week on More or Less, Jessica and Brit hold down the fort (while the husbands ski Alaska’s powder) with media heavyweights Ben Smith of Semafor and Nick Carlson of Dynamo. This week’s big swings:• The Signal Group Chat Scandal• DOGE divides: Silicon Valley cheers efficiency, DC smells ideology• China’s BYD overtakes Tesla: Is Elon losing supporters?Plus, whispers of fake AI revenue, ChatGPT’s image wizardry, and a nod to The Information’s SABEW haul. Featuring: 1) Ben Smith: Nicholas Carlson: also on ↓X: with us here:1) Ben Smith: Nicholas Carlson: Sam Lessin: Dave Morin: Jessica Lessin: Brit Morin: Trailer01:29 Our guests and our husband clones08:23 The Signal group chat scandal12:01 The Atlantic's marketing19:25 Ethics impact23:27 DOGE divides35:06 Trump, the tech giants and pragmatism39:35 Wiz deal, arms race, 42:44 11X and straight up fraud49:50 ChatGPT's Image Generator51:41 Using AI: what would JD Vance do? 55:40 AI and journalism side by side57:02 Outro

2025-03-28•55mins
#11

#91: Google’s $32B Deal and a Silicon Valley Spy Scandal!

Silicon Valley’s heating up—and we’ve got the inside scoop.This week on More or Less, Jessica, Dave, Sam, and Brit unpack a whirlwind of drama: Google’s $32B Wiz grab, rippling’s spy scandal with Deel, and Gwyneth Paltrow’s bold intimacy coordinator diss. Dave’s back from YC Demo Day, where AI-driven startups are still fetching 25 to 40 million despite shaky traction.Here’s what’s cooking:• Google’s Wiz deal—will Trump’s FTC let it fly?• Rippling vs. Deel: a spy caught in a Slack honeypot• Gwyneth says no to intimacy coordinators—culture’s shifting• Brit’s new AI-built app, Guarding, locks down kids’ usernamesPlus, Solana’s PR flop, NVIDIA’s chip wars, and Elon’s billion-dollar X raise.We’re also on ↓X: with us here:1) Sam Lessin: Dave Morin: Jessica Lessin: Brit Morin: Trailer01:10 No introductions needed03:34 The New York Times Ethics Department07:06 Solana video disaster13:16 Gwyneth Paltrow vs intimacy coordinator17:03 Google acquires Wiz for $32 billion18:59 Trump administration's tech leverage30:08 Brit's app Guardling (higuardling.com)35:06 The Silicon Valley Spy Scandal!46:34 Are there VC spies?50:53 Elon raises a billion for X52:19 Drive-through AI and going bankrupt56:29 Sam Lessin has left the chat59:03 Outro

2025-03-21•1hr 0mins
#12

#90: Silicon Valley Unscripted: Billionaires, AI, and Interplanetary Exploration

On this week's episode of More or Less, Jessica, Dave, Sam, and Brit tackle a chaotic week hashing out Waymo’s Peninsula push, Sam’s million-dollar Mars wager with Brit, and YC’s agentic AI craze—fresh from ski season vibes and office debates.Also on the deck this episode:• Waymo’s expansion has Jessica ditching Lyft (almost)• Sam vs. Brit: a million bucks on Mars colonization odds• TikTok’s sale—Oracle’s in, but ByteDance might still call the shots• Anthropic’s CEO says AI will write all code soon—engineers aren’t having it.Plus, recession drums beat louder, Jessica’s tennis mag Racket swings big, and Sam’s still trolling with billboards.We’re also on ↓X: with us here:1) Sam Lessin: Dave Morin: Jessica Lessin: Brit Morin: Trailer + Introduction01:46 Sam has another billboard!04:23 Waymo news09:12 New space age, flying motorcycles, tech CEOs14:21 Starlink, rockets, the space war use case19:56 More or Less bet: humans on Mars by 2040?24:34 Can this entity afford TikTok?27:53 Recession? Who cares?35:32 Startups are recession-proof42:30 Anthropic and vibe coding44:55 Billionaire free caltrain45:29 What's on our Instagram explore pages?47:42 Tennis magazine

2025-03-14•56mins
#13

#89: America’s Crypto Reserve, Nvidia’s $600M Hit & Digg’s Comeback

Markets move fast—sometimes too fast.This week, Jessica, Dave, Sam, and Brit dissect Trump’s crypto reserve play, Nvidia’s AI stumbles, and how nostalgia is sneaking back into everything. Recorded amidst ski trips, surf plans, and a billboard that’s trolling AI hype, the crew unpacks it all.Also on deck:• Core Weave’s $1.7B AI cloud grab signals robotics is the new VC darling• Reports of Discord going public?Plus, Jessica’s surf weekend drama, Sam’s “Trump Make Poor” bit, and a hot take on why live sports might be overrated. It’s chaos, it’s volatility, it’s Episode 89 of More or Less.We’re also on ↓X: with us here:1) Sam Lessin: Dave Morin: Jessica Lessin: Brit Morin: Trailer01:10 Make startups weird again02:24 The Brit brand theory04:01 TikTok, DeepSeek and the nostalgia supercycle05:48 Do people even watch live sports anymore? 08:36 Running Point and feminist humor10:12 "New old, old new" companies16:26 "Spam" Lessin's billboard20:35 Driverless Waymo on the 10121:59 Wall Street Journal tech layoffs28:17 Trump make rich, Trump McPoor34:52 AI, AGI and the Top Gun Theory37:40 IPOs, massages, robot sex workers45:16 Girls' surf trip with margaritas and poker47:46 Indian Wells!52:18 Outro

2025-03-07•53mins
#14

#88: Meta’s $200B AI Bet, Instagram Reels & The Future of Content

What happens when the biggest VCs, LPs, and founders cram into one basketball stadium? Deals get made, gossip flies, and Dave and Brit Morin find themselves in a very questionable hotel situation. Reporting live from LA, they break down everything happening at Upfront Summit—or at least, everything they overheard by the coffee station.On deck this episode:• is Bezos finally embracing his role as a media mogul?• Meta’s $200B spend vs. Grok’s lightning-fast scale• what really went down in Silicon Valley?All that, plus Dave’s latest case for why everyone should quit social media, in this Episode of More or Less.We’re also on ↓X: with us here:1) Sam Lessin: ⁠ Dave Morin: ⁠ Jessica Lessin: ⁠ Brit Morin: ⁠ Intro01:13 Live from the Upfront Summit03:04 Intuit and taxes06:37 Bezo's media shift12:26 Blantant bias and framing18:53 Meme coins are fascinating25:39 Make Instagram great again32:44 Big Tech and Trump34:19 Google search traffic is down36:35 AI segment: Grok45:08 The AI markets meme narrative55:40 Time Women of the Year Gala59:04 Outro

2025-02-28•1hr 0mins
#15

#87: SKIMS To Revive Nike? AI Drama & The Satoshi Mystery

Elon Musk trolled Jessica on X—at least, that’s how it seems.Was it just a marketing stunt for Grok 3, with The Information as the sacrificial lamb?Plus, Humane’s AI pin flopped, but HP swooped in for a $160M “rescue.”What does this mean for the AI hardware race? Sam has some strong opinions (spoiler: he’s not a fan of AI printers).And the internet’s latest rabbit hole: Could Jack Dorsey actually be Satoshi?Social media is unraveling, AI is becoming hyper-personalized (maybe too much so), and the next wave of consumer tech is either flopping or skyrocketing at warp speed.All that—plus the latest chaos in AI, Big Tech, and beyond—on Episode 87 of More or Less.We’re also on ↓X: with us here:1) Sam Lessin: Dave Morin: Jessica Lessin: Brit Morin: Introduction(00:01:20) Bay Area ski week(00:02:38) Yoga(00:06:43) Grok 3 vs The Information(00:12:26) Best deep research model? (00:19:30) iOS bug and social media isolation(00:23:42) iPhone 16e and status symbols(00:27:49) Digital drugs(00:33:21) Do brands even matter anymore?(00:43:00) Humane fire sale and AI Printers?(00:47:07) Founders who can land a plane(00:53:31) Lost Meta "international spy technology"(00:55:40) More Or Less correspondents(00:56:50) Jack created Bitcoin?(01:00:32) Outro

2025-02-21•1hr 2mins
#16

#86: Elon’s $97B Curveball For OpenAI

Elon Musk just threw OpenAI into chaos with a $97 billion bid for its nonprofit arm. But does he actually want it—or is it just for the memes?Meanwhile, Slow Ventures has secured $60M to bet on the future of creators, and Brit and Jessica predict the rise of serial influencers.Oh, and Google Maps is broken. Seriously. All that and more in Episode of More or Less.We’re also on ↓X: Instagram: Spotify: Connect with us here: 1) Sam Lessin: 2) Dave Morin: 3) Jessica Lessin: 4) Brit Morin: Trailer(00:01:07) Dressing well(00:03:38) Startups, hybrid work(00:11:47) Efficiency and productivity(00:18:51) Apple Intelligence (00:20:44) Google Maps(00:22:31) Elon's OpenAI bid(00:33:26) Who buys TikTok? (00:35:27) Bill Gates(00:41:31) Investing on people and adventure capital(00:50:30) 360 deals and musicians(00:52:34) Investing in niche creators(00:56:39) Super Bowl LIX and Kendrick Lamar(01:01:55) Outro

2025-02-14•1hr 2mins
#17

#85: The $250M Meme Coin Experiment

Sam and Dave had been toying with the idea of making $$ from meme mania, but after last week’s pod, they may have taken it a little too seriously.They launched Jelly-My-Jelly ($JELLYJELLY), a meme coin that shot up to $250M—thanks, in part, to Venmo co-founder Iqram Magdon-Ismail.What happened next? Tune in to Episode to find out.We’re also on ↓X: with us here:1) Sam Lessin: Dave Morin: Jessica Lessin: Brit Morin: Trailer(00:01:01) Ski race and poker(00:03:00) Dave and Sam's newly-launched project(00:13:19) Fartcoin is serious(00:19:11) Everything will be tokenized(00:33:04) PvP system(00:36:47) Regulation side, Coinbase, jellyjelly(00:49:16) DOGE against the US Government?(01:06:56) Pop culture corner(01:09:52) Outro

2025-02-07•1hr 10mins
#18

#84: China's DeepSeek Shakes the Tech World

DeepSeek—a name no one had even heard of until last week—has since given Big Tech a run for its money. Soon after the news, they torched $1 trillion from Nvidia and other giants' market caps. And while AI researchers call it “distillation,” aren’t LLMs recursive by design? Everyone’s distilling someone else’s work. The real question: Did DeepSeek actually crack efficient training? Or just drop the right meme at the right time? We’re also on ↓ X: Instagram: Spotify: Connect with us here: 1) Sam Lessin: 2) Dave Morin: 3) Jessica Lessin: 4) Brit Morin: (00:00:00) Trailer (00:01:03) Under the weather (00:01:43) News overload (00:05:16) Subscriptions, trust, parasocial relationships (00:14:21) DeepSeek and meme warfare (00:29:09) Meme coins and the future of digital economy (00:39:03) Regulation and trends (00:44:04) AI is the tale of two cities (00:49:40) Meta's strategic position (00:55:29) DeepSeek questions (00:59:13) Sam's watchlist (01:01:35) Outro

2025-01-31•1hr 3mins
#19

#83: Trump Inauguration, Stargate, and the Meme Economy

Stargate—a $500 billion AI venture straight from Trump 2.0's White House—has all the drama of a sci-fi blockbuster. But instead of aliens (like in the movie from 30 years ago), we’ve got Elon Musk, Satya Nadella, and Sam Altman trading shots. “SoftBank doesn’t have the money,” Elon posted on X, while Microsoft’s Nadella shot back, “I’m good for my $80 billion.” Meanwhile, Altman’s keeping things spicy with OpenAI already breaking ground. Also on the docket: • $TRUMP token, • the inauguration at Capitol Hill, and • if SoftBank buys, must you sell? We’re also on ↓ X: Instagram: Spotify: Connect with us here: 1) Sam Lessin: 2) Dave Morin: 3) Jessica Lessin: 4) Brit Morin:

2025-01-24•51mins
#20

#82: TikTok, Trade Wars & Tech 2.0

On this week’s episode of More or Less, Meta kills DEI and fact-checking (right after their $27B moderation exit), Zuck's talking "masculine energy" on Rogan, and TikTok's facing a ban while DJI mysteriously drops US flight restrictions. It's not even February. We also share opinions on: • why tech's gender gap persists (18% of CS grads are women) • whether Elon's X could inherit TikTok's distribution • what NYC's congestion tax reveals about tech's bubble Just another week in Silicon Valley's great realignment. We’re also on ↓ X: Instagram: Spotify: Connect with us here: 1) Sam Lessin: 2) Dave Morin: 3) Jessica Lessin: 4) Brit Morin: 00:00 Trailer 01:22 Tech's gender gap 07:52 Balancing Masculine and Feminine Energies 18:36 Implications of TikTok Ban 26:52 If TikTok goes dark 30:51 Balkanization 38:21 Inauguration 41:01 Wellness festival 44:12 Congestion tax and consumption patterns 48:08 Girl math 49:41 Los Angeles 53:10 Outro

2025-01-17•54mins
#21

#81: Meta's Community Notes: More Speech and Fewer Mistakes?

Meta is ditching fact-checkers, Nvidia hitting $3T, and everyone is building robots for some reason. Episode # 81 of More or Less kicks off 2025 by asking: • How much of Zuck's community notes pivot is political theater? • Can NVIDIA actually pull off this "mega omniverse" industrial AI play? • Will companies thrive as the great tech exodus accelerates? Plus: Sam explains why centralized moderation was always destined to fail (backed by that wild 30% spike in misinfo post-fact-checking), Dave remains unimpressed by CES's 170,000-person gadget circus, and Brit introduces us to Generation Beta -- the first true AI natives. Bonus round: Is 2025 the year Texas tech finally takes the crown? We’re also on ↓ X: Instagram: Spotify: Connect with us here: 1) Sam Lessin: 2) Dave Morin: 3) Jessica Lessin: 4) Brit Morin: (00:00) Trailer (01:50) Introduction (03:02) CES, NVIDIA, Generation Beta (10:00) Breaking down Zuck’s announcement (25:22) What could go wrong? (38:34) Los Angeles (40:46) Robots (44:01) Pop Culture Corner (47:50) Outro

2025-01-10•49mins
#22

#80: The More or Less Holiday Special Pt. 2 (Crypto and Antitrust)

Time for Part 2 of our More or Less highlights special! We've curated some clips to check off our tech bingo card for 2024. This past year gave us Trump swapping press rooms for podcasts, the DOJ taking swings at Big Tech, BlackRock's Bitcoin ETF hitting record highs ($50B AUM) and—because why not—a government department named after DOGE, a not so subtle nod to Trump's pro-crypto stance. What's in store for 2025? We’re also on ↓ X: Instagram: Spotify: Connect with us here: 1) Sam Lessin: 2) Dave Morin: 3) Jessica Lessin: 4) Brit Morin: (0:00) Intro (1:13) Mar 29, 2024 | Apple v. DOJ (8:53) Aug 9, 2024 | Google Antitrust Decision (14:08) Oct 11, 2024 | Google's Potential Breakup (26:46) Jun 12, 2023 | Crypto and the SEC (35:27) Dec 8, 2023 | Crypto bounces back (46:30) Nov 15, 2024 | D.O.G.E. (01:03:16) Dec 6, 2024 | Trump and Web3 (01:10:56) Outro

2025-01-04•1hr 11mins
#23

#79: The More or Less Holiday Special Pt. 1 (AI Highlights)

Welcome to Part 1 of the More or Less highlights special! We’re taking a look back at an action-packed year in AI, from groundbreaking developments to game-changing predictions about the future. Don’t miss this collection of standout moments and stay tuned for Part 2! We’re also on ↓ X: ⁠ Instagram: ⁠ Spotify: ⁠ Connect with us here: 1) Brit Morin: ⁠ 2) Dave Morin: ⁠ 3) Jessica Lessin: ⁠ 4) Sam Lessin: ⁠ (00:00:00) Introduction (00:00:54) SEGMENT 1: OpenAI Developer Day, Altman firing (00:01:08) OpenAI Developer Day and GPTs (00:15:22) CEO Sam Altman was fired (00:35:27) SEGMENT 2: Apple + OpenAI, LLMs Business Realities (00:35:42) Apple Intelligence (00:51:51) SEGMENT 3: Agentic Predictions, Adoption, Business Models (00:52:23) OpenAI's Mega Funding Round (01:08:39) Agentic future and Building software through AI (01:24:25) Silicon Valley Hype Waves, Tech Infrastructure and Great Products (01:40:11) Outro

2024-12-27•1hr 40mins

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#24

#78: 2024 Tech Company of the Year + 2025 Predictions

In this episode, the Morins & Lessins dive into the highs and lows of 2024 to uncover who came out on top. Google made a strong showing, but are they well-positioned for the long haul? Waymo keeps moving the needle with self-driving cars and big moves in AI, making it a strong contender for years to come. Apple? They’ve been a bit slow to innovate this year, but don’t count them out just yet. Meta really hit their stride in 2024, proving the naysayers wrong. AI? Check. Hardware? Check. Will they keep the momentum going? Let’s get into it. In this episode, the Morins & Lessins dive into the highs and lows of 2024 to uncover who came out on top. Google made a strong showing, but are they well-positioned for the long haul? Waymo keeps moving the needle with self-driving cars and big moves in AI, making it a strong contender for years to come. Apple? They’ve been a bit slow to innovate this year, but don’t count them out just yet. Meta really hit their stride in 2024, proving the naysayers wrong. AI? Check. Hardware? Check. Will they keep the momentum going? Let’s get into it. We’re also on ↓ X: Instagram: Spotify: Connect with us here: 1) Brit Morin: 2) Dave Morin: 3) Jessica Lessin: 4) Sam Lessin: (00:00:00) Trailer + Introduction (00:01:46) God bless capitalism (00:04:08) A+ love story, 3-hour marathon (00:07:32) 2024 Tech Outlook (00:09:50) Why AI was transformative (00:13:21) A major year for tech? (00:17:55) A remarkable year for VC (00:31:51) Waymo (00:35:35) The company of the year (00:53:29) 2025 Predictions (01:03:20) Food, health, pop culture, sports (01:08:15) Outro

2024-12-20•1hr 9mins
#25

#77: Sora Reveal, Google's AI Agents and Digital Trade Under Trump

How will OpenAI's latest video technology affect the creator ecosystem? Could this new tech pave the way for a new type of entertainment? Also in this episode ↓ - Does Google have a lead in the AI race? - Should digital trade play a larger role in policy discussions? - The End of the Eras Tour and Sam's Pink Pilates Princess Strut Pop Season We’re also on ↓ X: Instagram: Spotify: Connect with us here: 1) Brit Morin: 2) Dave Morin: 3) Jessica Lessin: 4) Sam Lessin: 00:00 Trailer 01:24 Introduction 02:04 The Eras Tour 06:56 AI, TikTok, and Arrests 07:31 AI Video Debate 10:28 Creator Economy and AI Tools 16:10 Trust and Attention in Creator Businesses 19:24 Digital Drugs and AI Content 22:13 Spotify Wrapped and Music Trends 27:54 AI Agents 35:04 The Death of the Open Web? 39:42 Policy, Big Tech, and Digital Trade 48:29 Reflecting on Leadership in Media and Policy 52:18 Amazon Autos and Miata Chronicles 55:01 Outro

2024-12-13•56mins
#26

#76: In a World with 99.99% Accurate AI… (feat. Aaron Levie)

What’s it like being the CEO of Box and a full-time internet meme lord? Well… ask Aaron Levie. In this episode, he joins Jess, Dave, and Sam to answer: • what it’s like being a “toxic Bitcoin maxi” as the price soars past $100k • more or less M&A for MAANG • how far we are from AGI We’re also on ↓ X: Instagram: Spotify: Connect with us here: 1) Aaron Levie: 2) Sam Lessin: 3) Dave Morin: 4) Jessica Lessin: 5) Brit Morin: 00:00 Trailer 01:27 Introduction 05:26 Web3, Crypto Enthusiasm 13:44 Political Dynamics in Tech 22:27 Antitrust and Regulatory Challenges 34:59 The Future of AI in Enterprise Software 40:36 The Personal App Revolution 43:47 AI Accuracy 51:38 Killer Use Cases and Business Models 1:01:59 Future Predictions 1:05:02 Pop Culture Corner 1:07:10 Outro

2024-12-06•1hr 9mins
#27

#75: The Rise of the Tech Bro

The artist vs. tech bros—classic tension or chaos ahead? In EP 75, Brit, Dave, and Jess are joined by Matt Vascellaro as they dive into: • Sora's leak and the fiery backlash from Hollywood • The uneasy marriage of AI and art, and why the "right" UI still feels like chasing rainbows • And, of course, the rise (and roast) of the Bay Area tech bro We’re also on ↓ X: Instagram: Spotify: Connect with us here: 1) Matt Vascellaro: 2) Brit Morin: 3) Dave Morin: 4) Jessica Lessin:

2024-11-29•1hr 2mins
#28

#74: Winding Down From a $400M Fundraise, or How to Move Forward After Forward (with Adrian Aoun)

Meet Adrian Aoun—an OG listener and one of Alphabet’s best-kept secrets. He recently wound down Forward, his company that set out to reinvent the doctor’s office with AI. He joins Brit, Dave, and Jess in this episode to explore the exit, Adrian’s hardware + software play with CarePods, and what it means to create a generational company for healthcare. Also on the agenda: • is primary care venture-scalable? • are Elon & Trump BFFs?? • Optimus for the military??? We’re also on ↓ X: Instagram: Spotify: Connect with us here: 1) Adrian Aoun: 2) Brit Morin: 3) Dave Morin: 4) Jessica Lessin: 00:00:00 Trailer 00:01:17 Introduction 00:02:22 Navigating New York City 00:07:13 Some Silicon Valley history 00:11:05 More Or Less: Trump and Musk 00:15:36 Forward's Journey and Challenges 00:24:00 Healthcare Innovations and Market Shifts 00:30:07 Future of Healthcare and Business Models 00:43:39 Unwinding a company 00:47:31 Healthcare Technology Adoption 00:59:15 The Emotional and Logistical Aspects 01:01:55 Outro

2024-11-22•1hr 4mins
#29

#73: Elon to Lead DOGE, Bitcoin Surges & the Trump Alliance

With Musk’s bio now updated to read, “The people voted for major government reform,” it’s clear he’s not just dabbling in policy. In this episode, the Morins and Lessins break down what it means for democracy when a “super VC” like Musk mingles tech interests with government influence. Also on the docket: - will Bitcoin surge to $100K? - monetization for LLMs, and - the new wave of Silicon Valley internships in government We’re also on ↓ X: Instagram: Spotify: Connect with us here: 1) Brit Morin: 2) Dave Morin: 3) Jessica Lessin: 4) Sam Lessin: Mark Zuckerberg & T-Pain's New Song 'Get Low': 00:00:00 Trailer 00:01:10 Introduction and Brit’s New Look 00:03:17 IV Drip, Lingo, suPAR 00:08:49 PSA: Cookies and Feedbacks 00:10:09 Another big week in AI 00:12:30 Department of Government Efficiency 00:21:53 The cryptos and the VCs 00:29:39 AI in B2B2C and Verticalized Markets 00:37:50 AI Investment Strategies and Market Trends 00:52:32 Pop Culture Corner: Zuck and T-Pain 01:00:15 Outro

2024-11-15•1hr 1mins
#30

#72: Trump's Influencer Strategy Pays Off and the Future of App Building (with Guillermo Rauch!)

Are incumbent media networks losing ground? Kamala stuck to broadcast media, while Trump bypassed traditional filters and reached audiences as an influencer, taking his message to Rogan and Fridman. Among concerns over echo chambers and AI-controlled narratives, there’s a flip side—more people now have a platform, giving everyone a voice. Guillermo Rauch of Vercel says “everyone needs to be empowered to create.” The more people who can build their own platforms and apps, the more we decentralize the conversation. Tune in as we break down the election aftermath and the future of content in a post-AI world. We’re also on ↓ X: Instagram: Spotify: Connect with us here: 1) Brit Morin: 2) Dave Morin: 3) Jessica Lessin: 4) Sam Lessin:

2024-11-08•1hr 9mins
#31

#71: Big Tech Earnings and the AI Revolution

In this episode, the crew dives into why no self-respecting Silicon Valley developer is ditching AI tools anytime soon. Sam and Jess go back and forth on Snap’s subscription model and whether it can stand up to Meta’s dominance. Plus, Bezos seems wary of a potential Trump comeback. We’re also on ↓ X: Instagram: Spotify: Connect with us here: 1) Brit Morin: 2) Dave Morin: 3) Jessica Lessin: 4) Sam Lessin: 00:00:00 Trailer 00:01:02 Introduction 00:01:22 Phone problems as features 00:07:00 Tech earnings season overview 00:09:45 Meta's quarterly performance and VR discussion 00:15:30 Google and Microsoft's AI-driven growth 00:19:55 User growth for tech companies 00:23:56 How users are using Snapchat 00:30:46 Get laid, get paid, get entertained 00:36:40 Earnings predictions 00:40:09 Creator economy's influence on election campaigns 00:51:09 Bezos ends Washington Post presidential endorsements 00:57:53 Celebrity collaborations and entertainment updates 01:03:47 Outro

2024-11-01•1hr 4mins
#32

#70: Is Apple’s Vision Out of Focus?

Apple’s Vision Pro has had its fair share of challenges. Initially aiming for 3 million units, the forecast adjusted down to 900,000, then 800,000, and ultimately? Just 450,000 sold. For a $3,500 device, that's a tough spot to be in. Going from developer kit to flagship in a hurry? Classic Apple. In this episode, the Morins and Lessins talk about: - Apple vs Meta on AR - AI & mental health, and - journalistic integrity in tech reporting We’re also on ↓ X: Instagram: Spotify: Connect with us here: 1) Brit Morin: 2) Dave Morin: 3) Jessica Lessin: 4) Sam Lessin:

2024-10-25•1hr 5mins
#33

#69: Robots, Rockets, and Elon Hype

Elon’s robots are real... kind of? On this episode of More or Less, we take a deep dive into the duality of Tesla. Are we witnessing the future or yet another Disney ride? Tune in as Brit, Dave, Sam, and Jess unpack: • Tesla’s We, Robot event • Why the retail army craves Planet Elon • Waymo & the future of robovehicles • Late-stage capitalism We’re also on ↓ X: Instagram: Spotify: Connect with us here: 1) Brit Morin: 2) Dave Morin: 3) Jessica Lessin: 4) Sam Lessin:

2024-10-18•55mins
#34

#68: Google's Antitrust Saga Continues…

Google’s enjoyed a monopoly-sized head start for a while. But it now looks like the DOJ’s ready to throw a wrench in its works. Is a breakup of the search giant on the cards? In EP 068 of the pod, Brit, Dave, and Jess talk all things: - antitrust and Google, - screen time and parental control, and - why leveraging AI for consumer apps might still be a pipe dream. We’re also on ↓ YouTube: X: Instagram: Connect with us here: 1) Brit Morin: 2) Dave Morin: 3) Jessica Lessin: 4) Sam Lessin: Chapters: 00:00 Trailer 01:11 Introduction 04:25 Google: A Breakup On The Cards? 08:24 Big Tech & Antitrust 27:43 Screen Time & Devices 31:14 Ditch Your Phone 32:14 Dr. Becky & Parenting 33:06 Health & Longevity 34:00 Spin-Offs: Good For Big Tech? 35:36 AI Predictions 43:52 The Future of Software 50:51 Consumer AI & Business Models 59:12 AI at Wimbledon and Final Thoughts

2024-10-11•1hr 2mins
#35

#67: OpenAI Sets a Record and Will Apple Make Its Next Move?

OpenAI Sets a Record and Will Apple Make Its Next Move? 00:00 - Introduction and The @VCBrags Twitter Account04:48 - The Sam and Dave Contest07:15 - OpenAI's Record-Breaking Funding Round13:04 - OpenAI's Product Strategy Shift18:05 - The Future of A.I. and Consumer Experiences19:28 - Apple's Potential in the A.I. Space26:23 - The Impact of A.I. on Software Development33:55 - Dave's Three A.I. Buckets: Fast, Slow, and Edge Models35:54 - Insane Evaluations and VC Funds39:24 - How Japan's Declining Birthrate is a Good Thing43:10 - Pop Culture Corner46:47 - Closing Thoughts and Future Tech Trends in Japan

2024-10-04•50mins
#36

#66: Meta Connect, the Hardware Renaissance (or Not?) and Special Guest Dan Feder 

Meta Connect, the Hardware Renaissance (or Not?) and Special Guest Dan Feder

2024-09-27•54mins
#37

#65: Instagram, YouTube and the Kids

Plus, China, the supply chain and Sam climbs a mountain. MrBeast Strategy Doc: 0:00 - Introduction and Debriefing Sam's Mountain Climbing Trip 5:50 - Instagram's New Teen Controls 10:20 - The Role of Tech Companies in Child Safety 12:34 - YouTube's New Hype Feature 13:30 - MrBeast's Leaked Strategy Doc 15:00 - Parental Controls 22:10 - Are YouTube Hypes just Tips? 27:45 - Amazon and The Shift Back to In-Person Work 32:54 - Temu and Regulation Loopholes 40:30 - Sam's Phrase: "Lick the Cookie" 41:50 - Crypto Innovations and Investments

2024-09-20•50mins
#38

#64: Meta vs. Apple: the Future of Open vs. Closed Tech

Plus, is MrBeast the new BuzzFeed? And the latest with Stripe. Sam's MrBeast is Buzzfeed 2.0: 00:00 - Introduction and A Mystery 02:54 - An Honest Review of The Mill 04:46 - The Happenings and Headlines 05:16 - Reflections on The Acquired Podcast Live with Mark Zuckerburg 14:41 - A Critique of the Live Podcast Format 16:43 - Reflections on The Apple Launch Event 22:13 - New Markets for Apple to Break Into: CPAPs and Parental Controls 27:59 - An Honest Review of Bevel 29:54 - Revisiting the Parental Controls Conversation 30:19 - The Information's AI Summit 31:44 - University of Michigan's Venture Summit 33:37 - The Bill Gurley Chronicles 39:06 - Is MrBeast the New BuzzFeed? 48:39 - Strategies and Business Models for the Creator Economy 55:19 - The Intersection of the Payments Business and the Creator Economy 59:08 - PCC: The US Presidential Debate 1:00:10 - Outro

2024-09-13•1hr 1mins
#39

#63: 'Nasty' Founder Mode

The right—and wrong—lessons about tech's favorite new topic. Plus, a new type of parental warning. Show Notes: 00:00 - Introduction and Labor Day Tennis02:00 - Pickleball03:00 - Founder Mode05:00 - Organizational Structures12:00 - Founder Mode from a VC Perspective15:00 - Galaxy Brain vs. 100 Nodes18:00 - Uber vs. AirBNB22:00 - Optimizers vs. Builders25:00 - The Parent Analogy26:00 - Different Types of Founders30:00 - VC-backed Company Incentives33:00 - Long-Term Trajectory of Founders37:00 - Running a Business for Wall Street vs. Founder Mode39:00 - The Challenges of AirBNB43:00 - A Nasty Idea46:00 - Data Centers: A "Dick Measuring Contest"49:00 - The Surgeon General's Warning on Parenting52:30 - A Pool House Guest

2024-09-06•53mins
#40

#62: Telegram, Free Speech and Its Limits

Plus, Burning Man and Zuck's political moves.

2024-08-30•55mins
#41

#61: The Venture Capital Reset Era

Plus, a preview of Sam's new opus. And a More or Less fall meetup! Show Notes: 00:00 - Introduction and Vacation Plans 01:14 - Sam's Unpublished Document on Higher Education 04:44 - Joe Rogan's Peter Thiel Interview Pt. 1 08:35 - Health and Wellness Trends 12:33 - Joe Rogan's Peter Thiel Interview Pt. 2 16:39 - The Reset Phase 25:06 - Capital-Efficient Investments 31:14 - Understanding S-Curves and A.I. 51:09 - Tinkerers in the Startup Ecosystem 59:12 - Apple's Prestige Dad TV

2024-08-23•1hr 2mins
#42

#60: Body Futurism and Why Gen Z is Ditching Tech

Plus, thank you Susan Wojcicki and the truth about remote work.

2024-08-16•59mins
#43

#59: Google: Can it Outrun Regulation?

Plus, Sam's Instagram splurge and new science on how women should work out.

2024-08-09•57mins
#44

#58: The Death of Friends

Plus, why you should short Nvidia (but don't) plus Silicon Valley swarms the Hamptons.

2024-08-02•1hr 7mins
#45

#57: Zuckerberg’s Open Source AI Manifesto

Plus, the Morins teach the Lessins about streetwear and BRAT culture. And the full quad debates ideas for both presidential candidates' social media teams.

2024-07-26•57mins
#46

#56: Trump and the PayPal Mafia

Inside the moves and motivations behind the new wave of Trump-VC endorsements. Plus, Sam returns from Kilimanjaro.

2024-07-19•45mins
#47

#55: The Modern Press Playbook with Jess

Plus, techies and their quantified sports.

2024-07-12•44mins
#48

#54: Sun Valley, Tennis and Robots: Summer Adventure Preview

Who is in—and out—at this year's annual Allen & Co. conference? Plus, racquet sports, robots, and how the summer is shaping up in tech.

2024-07-05•57mins
#49

#53: What We Got Wrong—and Right—in a Year of More or Less

Are IPOs relevant? RIP AGI? The gang looks back on our debates and predictions and how we'd refine our views based on what we know now.

2024-06-28•53mins
#50

#52: Elad Gil on What to Build in AI (Part II)

The gang focuses on the exit opportunities for AI startups and whether there will be a growing wave of AI buyouts. Plus, debating the surgeon general's warning about social networks and kids.

2024-06-21•1hr 1mins

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